Wolfgang Suschitzky

Speechmatics Transcript

Wolfgang Suschitzky Side 1

SPEAKER: M1
ACTT. History Project. Manny US and Bob Dunbar interviewing Wolfgang Suschitzky.
Where were you born. I was born in Austria Vienna in 1912. I went to school there and from the age of 10 or 11 to 18 I went to boarding school and matriculated at the end then I had to decide whether to go to university or to learn some other profession or trade.
SPEAKER: M5
And as it was during the Depression and my stay in Australia was uncertain I thought it's better to land a practical job which I could do anywhere. Originally I wanted to start to study zoology.
SPEAKER: F1
My sister at that time was at the bar house and decided to learn photography and I think that in France my choice of profession then took up photography at the state school for photography in Vienna where I studied for three years and left with a diploma and soon afterwards I decided to do it and had the situation of Austria was so precarious.
SPEAKER: M9
There was street fighting in 1934 and our family being known as socialists and as Jews made me decide to emigrate. By that time my sister had married an English doctor and she was in London which made it easier for me to enter Britain. It was very difficult in those days. The depression had hit Britain too and they tried to keep out as many people as they could because they had unemployment which was very understandable. So I came to study English which was permitted which I did but uh I did a course at London University and you want me to go on cut right.
SPEAKER: M2
To it. Could you tell us a little more of the political background in Vienna in your youth.
SPEAKER: M4
Well to go back to my father he and his brothers started a bookshop in Manama with some difficulties. That man had to get a concession to start his shop and especially a bookshop and dad declared that as it was to be in a working class district of about 100000 inhabitants a bookshop wasn't necessary. There wasn't any other bookshop in the district anyway through intervention in parliament they got the concession in the year nineteen hundred and one and my father and his brother were both Social Democrats as they were called in Vienna who were much more Marxist and a English Labour party ever.
SPEAKER: M6
And it was I believe the first socialist bookshop in Miranda.
SPEAKER: M4
A few years later.
SPEAKER: M6
My father also started publishing books and there's a long list of his publications. So our family was known in the hold of and I should say as left wing.
SPEAKER: M4
And in 1974 there had begun to imprison trade unionists and even church people for protesting against the semi fascist government we had done in Austria how the total US government so as the economic situation was also very bad in Austria.
SPEAKER: M16
I decided to emigrate and it's just as well because not not long after bookshop was closed or the books were carted away and I don't know what happened to them and my father committed suicide and my uncle and his wife emigrated to France but that daughter lived and they disappeared there in nineteen seventy nine. My mother stayed down in Austria until 39 and then my sister and I managed to get her out and over here and she spent the rest of her days in England.
SPEAKER: M4
So I was very lucky to leave in good time.
SPEAKER: M10
I left in 1934 I had in the photographic school I attended met a Dutch girl whom I married here in England we both emigrated here but as I couldn't take work here we went to Holland and started at a little studio in Amsterdam and settled for but my marriage didn't last and only about a year.
SPEAKER: F5
So in 1975 I came back to England my sister put me up again.
SPEAKER: F1
She had a freelance photographic business and I helped her and I was able to settle some of my photographs as a freelance.
SPEAKER: M4
Two magazines up there in 1937 someone gave me an introduction to Basil right.
SPEAKER: M3
I forget who it was and who received me very kindly but he had no opening and his company realist films then even even Daniel was called realist films. He sent me across Oxford Street to strand films. Paul Rose I was one of the producers and I showed him some of my photographs and he's seemed to like them and he gave me an unpaid job because he wasn't allowed to to employ me. And that was my first connection with film strand film was a marvellous place to start because there were so many of the old British documentary people there. That was Arthur Frank Sainsbury Rupert Grierson John Taylor Donald Taylor was one of the producers show Alex Shaw who else was there while George Noble was my older cameraman and had a wreck note who perished during the war. Was there real progress and too was bombed on the ship going to the states.
SPEAKER: F8
That is John Grayson's sister.
SPEAKER: M9
I was assigned to a young director called Paul Brown forward to work on a series of zoo films which strand did with Julian Huxley as their scientific advisor who was then the secretary of the Zoological Society and I was very happy about that because of my interest in zoology so we started out.
SPEAKER: M4
My first job I remember the first day and I came prepared with sandwiches because I had no idea that you could get a lunch when your work in the films and we went out to whips Ned the director driving and on the way home he told his assistant his name was Schuyler who left and emigrated to Australia take the car back and he drove me to the first round about it was he only recently had to pass this test and we drove into a roundabout.
SPEAKER: M15
On the way home that's why I remember that day I suppose. Anyway we had all facilities in the IT they cut holes into the fences for us to stick our lens through and I never did.
SPEAKER: M3
And it was about time enough we could go into cages and I carried my stills camera and in between shots I could uh take photographs and some found that I could sell those pictures. So my unpaid job really provided me with some income what kind of movie camera did you have that first day.
SPEAKER: M4
And that was Dollhouse. In those days a yeoman think a camera and the old one the first models you had a prison bitch you pushed in for focusing then you pulled it out and took a picture and you had a very primitive viewfinder where you could adjust the parallax but of course then you went from a very close shot to a long shot.
SPEAKER: M10
You couldn't adjust the parallax in the middle of the shot but that was the standard camera for documentary films clockwork. Two Springs and it worked very well. It was quite reliable.
SPEAKER: M2
But the what is the angle was 35 more wasn't it at that time.
SPEAKER: M4
Yes I believe that was a special camera which took a twenty four or five yes.
SPEAKER: M5
Yes there was but you didn't have that one.
SPEAKER: M4
Not in the beginning and not at that time during the war.
SPEAKER: F3
I did work with a light camera too.
SPEAKER: M2
Yes they did. When did you start earning your money that you were you were earning it really. When did you stop being paid for it.
SPEAKER: M4
Well not till 1942 really. I had to interrupt at the outbreak of the war. I had to interrupt filming. I found myself a job with a medical firm but as welcome as a photographer doing scientific photographs and also some advertising photographs for them which kept me in a reserved occupation which otherwise I would have had to join a Pioneer Corps digging ditches and latrines and. I was scared to avoid that to be honest but in 1942 I ran into Donald Alexander just by accident and he suggested I should go and see Paul Roth again who had by then got his own from poor Roth productions and Paul was quite glad to see me because most people had joined up and there was a shortage of people about to had some film experience and he gave me my first job as a cameraman the first film I did was with Donald Alexander It was called life begins again and dealt with rehabilitation of injured miners.
SPEAKER: M3
What we did is we Donald had them big Vauxhall car and open car and we put forward two cars I believe we had into the back into the boot and some cable and the Newman Sinclair and the tripod where the Giro had and Donald and Butch Cooper and myself went out to make this film was budget assisting him at that time.
SPEAKER: M4
Lunch was assisting and read them time later on they met at the next thing after that but Cooper directed a film.
SPEAKER: M6
I've forgot to say that I learned a lot from Donald Alexander of course who was quite experienced even in those days and taught me a lot.
SPEAKER: M4
So much so that uh Rosa let me do the next film best buddy Cooper directing.
SPEAKER: M8
It was called Children of the city and dealt with delinquent children up north in Glasgow and Dundee. We did uh approved schools and generally the film dealt with the problem of delinquent children in the slums which again was quite an education for me to get into this princess I had no idea how people lived fairly I had been to the East End and had photographed streets which were pretty poor but to get into the homes of the people and speak to them and see how hard it is and Dundee the slums the tenements but 10 flats high and one toilet for each floor and outside taps and this primitive kind of living was really new to me so then you carried on with both poor Rose production and poor rose up production staff forgetting what year uh split up.
SPEAKER: M10
Uh mainly due to Donald Alexander's efforts.
SPEAKER: M4
I think and Donald and four or five others who had worked visit also started a co-operative company called Data.
SPEAKER: M3
It was probably the first cooperative film company in the country.
SPEAKER: M9
They joined the cooperative Producers Association in less that I believe they were who were very helpful lent us a little money to start this off they comprise shoe factories and co closing factories and that sort of thing. Cooperatives and of course we have something entirely new but they helped us to work out a constitution for the company and all that sort of thing and that worked quite well for over 10 years 10 to 12 years we were lucky enough to have a steady job doing mining review for the night for the co-op board which was a film magazine Monthly one of activities in the mining areas new technology in the mines and that sort of thing. Social activities of miners plays they put on any special skills miners had hobbies and it was very popular showed in 300 cinemas perhaps because it was free to us and unless it was a ten minute kind of newsreel magazine did the coal board not have its own film unit.
SPEAKER: M8
Not in those days. Now only one that I stopped making that they started and Frances gas and was this data and then cobalt took came over as producer on this magazine what other people work with you at data beginning.
SPEAKER: M3
That was Jack Chambers who was a very good director especially on scientific subjects. You had to give to make science popular and understandable and. But Cooper was there.
SPEAKER: F1
Pickering what was his first name.
SPEAKER: M4
My memory's slipping. Charles Smith was my assistant for some time who is now the expert on three dimensional films.
SPEAKER: F6
Peter Bradford came to join us.
SPEAKER: F2
And Francis Gus and I ordered and mentioned did you have a sound department.
SPEAKER: M2
Did you generally do think signed or not very often.
SPEAKER: M4
Not very often man if we did we uh engaged Sandman when uh.
SPEAKER: M13
When did you when you left data. Where did you go next.
SPEAKER: M4
Well I started freelancing.
SPEAKER: M10
Even during that time they sometimes let me do a job for outside companies and I had joined the majority of film technicians who were freelance and did films for worldwide.
SPEAKER: M4
I did two films which came on the oh Mary Beals I forgot was a better director during the war.
SPEAKER: F1
It was much easier for women to work in the film industry and be directors.
SPEAKER: M2
When did you do first to do so as opposed to it.
SPEAKER: M4
Well the first feature film that it was an all location film it was directed by Paul Rosser and it was called No resting place and shot in Ireland in County Wicklow mainly and it was one of the very early or location films so much so that demand from the film's bank called Lori came to visit us. They had put up some of the money to to see how it's done.
SPEAKER: M14
Was that also wrote his first feature film. Yes I think yes they had very bad rather unfortunately.
SPEAKER: M3
But somehow between the showers we managed to get the thing done and I think it still stands up quite well as a film had very good actors. Most of them from the Abbey Theatre in Dublin only Makar my memory can you cut the moment.
SPEAKER: M2
So you used did this who feature film on location. What kind of appearances did you take with you or on the place.
SPEAKER: M3
I believe it was a debris superpower powerful for sound shooting and of course it was optically sound in those days and you had to have a pick and technical arm of sound equipment the sound camera had to be set up every time before shooting land up and as far as I remember for Salon shots for of four shots which did not involve dialogue.
SPEAKER: F2
We used as a sync and lights.
SPEAKER: M4
Did you take a lot of it. Not a lot but we took let's a few five Ks and a few took.
SPEAKER: M2
So you had to have a generator.
SPEAKER: F2
Yes.
SPEAKER: M2
Then what was the next film after that that year.
SPEAKER: M4
The next film by the next feature film that did after that was something for group 3 which John Grierson was producer in charge of. And it was called the auditor. That was in 1952 directed panic Richards who used to be a cameraman and it was one of Virginia McKenna's first film and Mac and Metron was in it that was shot mainly in Dorset But Harding was the voice of the head.
SPEAKER: M14
Yes you've got a good memory.
SPEAKER: M9
I also worked at Group Three as a net was mainly on location. It had some studio films that other south or south tower studios.
SPEAKER: F2
Yes.
SPEAKER: M2
And did you see much of Grierson.
SPEAKER: M4
Not very much. He just occasionally walked through and patted me on the back and said You're doing a good job.
SPEAKER: F6
We didn't see much of Chris on that Chris and came along when we stopped at that time.
SPEAKER: F1
Talk to us. That's very friendly and I did meet him.
SPEAKER: M3
Then as I was lucky enough to meet most of the old British School of documentary.
SPEAKER: M2
Did you ever work with Basil right.
SPEAKER: M4
I never worked as best on that.
SPEAKER: M5
No but he had films shows at the Colonial Film Unit over in the same house as we were and Paul Ross and data at twenty one Soho Square they had Freddie Mac. I believe it was film shows features or documentaries and we met Humphrey Jennings there and all how to form a post office unit people and it was a very pleasant opportunity to talk to these people.
SPEAKER: M6
Author Elton and Frank Sainsbury risk turned up to this showings film shows so there was a good deal of cross-fertilization so to speak amongst the documentary film makers.
SPEAKER: M4
Yes I believe so yes.
SPEAKER: M3
And they published magazine rich Donald artic sound edited for some time I believe that film facts film fact and there was another one documentary film news source down did you use to contribute to any of these things now.
SPEAKER: M4
No I didn't have was never got at the writing because the whole documentary movement was rather idealistic.
SPEAKER: M5
They all signed Chris and the rest thought they could in France go to the better buy their films and I never really a hundred percent believe that was possible.
SPEAKER: M3
And people like Rosa for instance had a very theoretically approach to film making and he used statistics and pictorial statistics he used the old method of uh to set the in dialogue between audience and actors.
SPEAKER: M4
They never really made films like late but had a what did he who approached the subject from the human point of view from the individual point of view. Did you work with Harry on any films and did work later on this had a couple of films in the 60s.
SPEAKER: M12
I think between doing features presumably you also continued to do continue to do lots of documentaries.
SPEAKER: M4
Yes.
SPEAKER: M10
I was also in the 55 for instance lucky enough to get an assignment from the NBC in New York to do a film in India called Assignment India.
SPEAKER: M6
And later on a year in 1956 a similar film covering Southeast Asia which took us to Indonesia and Burma Thailand. So that was the first time I saw something of the east where these films primarily for American television they were.
SPEAKER: M14
Yes but as shown here it was.
SPEAKER: M4
Yes I believe they were on assignment in India. We had the former ambassador to India called Chester Bowles as a commentator and on assignment Southeast Asia.
SPEAKER: F2
We had Mitchell the writer and did you have any other crew from England or were they American.
SPEAKER: M4
We had some crew from England. Yes.
SPEAKER: M7
Yes we had a sound man was uh chick mountain yes King Mountain King Mountain.
SPEAKER: M15
And on boast films. And um we had some uh a segment on it from here to because it was cheaper for the Americans to probably us from here.
SPEAKER: M3
It was a bit nearer two in ten to Southeast Asia.
SPEAKER: M2
Did you have any Indian unit special you had.
SPEAKER: M4
Yes. We had Indian assistance and sparks.
SPEAKER: M6
Jan that will help us which worked very well especially in Indonesia from the Indonesian State Film Unit.
SPEAKER: M4
We had some very good assistance and who directed them to do American directors. The main producer was Bob Graff. And on assignment South East Asia I met my present wife.
SPEAKER: M5
That was in 1956. She was one of the best actress for NBC set when you came back from these adventures abroad.
SPEAKER: M1
Did you make some more feature films at all.
SPEAKER: M15
Well at 55 I'll get a little film called A bespoke overcoat Jackley which was the first film jacket directed. Uh Mr. Wolfe gave him I think 3000 pounds it was to try his hand on a film. And if Mankiewicz wrote the story after go and I think in the end it cost five thousand pound and we had. Alfred bass and David Kozlov as the actors and has it has become a little classic but about 20 minutes long. Was it too real. Yes 20 or 25 minutes and it was shot in medieval bones Studios which was a former church was under very difficult to instance. Jack wanted a track around the bed starting from behind the head and going all the way around ending up with a profile of Alfred best lying on the bed. So all we had in those days were a bit of oscillators and we did it on the smaller stage upstairs in metal bound and there was so little around that we had to shift furniture during the track written things which on live television people had gone on you had to do from the shops and was the operator and he was wonderful we had great fun making the film because the actors were so good.
SPEAKER: M5
The story was so good. Had a very good atmosphere because Jack was already an experienced producer.
SPEAKER: F1
Well yes you had produced touristy features before that and what other film did you follow up with in those days.
SPEAKER: M4
Well there were several short films. Did a film Miss my little for instance telling short stories. Dorothy Parker stories mainly directed by poor Dixon. I did a series for television 14 television films called say a lot of Fortune was from Mitchell and what else and then I did my first film with Harry what do for the World Health Organization for that tenth anniversary which was in 1957 that took us to Burma and Africa.
SPEAKER: F3
It was called people like Maria.
SPEAKER: M4
Harry also went to South America to do a one episode in the film. But they had to employ a local camera man because the budget wouldn't stand. My accompanying him but when he came back from the Andes from Taiwan I dunno probably 12000 feet up to Africa to Nigeria on the southern end of the Sahara.
SPEAKER: M5
He was so exhausted that he couldn't continue directing and I had to finish it on Mt..
SPEAKER: F1
They had hundred and ten in the shade in burning cubby in northern Nigeria and he had to return home and leave me to do the last two or three days after shooting that the only time you would ever direct it.
SPEAKER: M15
Yes yes. Well that it wasn't much that acting a bit on that you never had any ambition. I never had an ambition to do that. No I don't like to tell other people what to do. Really I like to be told what to do. Not that I don't like to contribute but I'm not a very forceful person.
SPEAKER: M1
But your work has a stamp of individuality I think comes out especially in your style of possibly.
SPEAKER: M3
I hope so. Well the fact that people still employ me I suppose there must be something in it.
SPEAKER: M1
When did you switch from the old Newman simply to Harry's cameras.
SPEAKER: M4
Well I can tell you the exact date but he added It didn't come in until maybe two or three years after the war. It was designed as a combat camera by the Germans and when we first used it it had a plastic get a soft gait and was astonishingly is that even in those days because there was no reason why it should be it had no register pin anything and.
SPEAKER: M10
But pretty soon it was developed and became much more reliable and was the standard and still is the standard camera of documentary filmmakers.

End of Side 1

Side 2 

SPEAKER: M1
Even in your work.
SPEAKER: M2
Uh did you tend to favour a rather low key style dieting or do you had no particular preferences.
SPEAKER: M8
Well it did and it said on the subject but I was brought up to have on it a minimum of flat economic reasons. So um as they will use the many member flat.
SPEAKER: F2
Uh but it has become much easier of course to use little at but in between.
SPEAKER: M8
Notice uh films I have mentioned that a lot of technical films down coal mines and steel works or something like the principles of I trust Sonic.
SPEAKER: M9
And uh precise measurements for engineers and a lot of uh films which had some use which they be tended to welcome in daytime and poor Rosa productions that that should have some positive uh use it to educate people. Make them aware of problems.
SPEAKER: M3
I did a film about Tropical Medicine and John Krish and I covered the building of Europe's most modern steelworks in Port Talbot in 1951 and they started it during these various expeditions to steelworks etc you would probably put in all sorts of quite dangerous situations wouldn't you.
SPEAKER: M8
Yes. One man doesn't really. One doesn't really care if one has a job to do and I went up in bucket of cranes a hand up Hamlet 50 foot high and all that held that bucket from tipping it was meant to tip when it did its job its proper job was one little steel bar or down a coal mine. I remember there was a new machine which was a huge Canadian screw which drilled into the coal face to get the code up and direct. I think it was Francis gas and said why wouldn't it be a lovely shot if we had this thing coming towards the camera.
SPEAKER: F6
So they drilled the hole they put me into the hole and with the camera and uh spot them up one doesn't think that uh there is danger.
SPEAKER: M1
I knew when you're out and doing a job perhaps that many cameramen when you're looking through the camera forget yes everything else is only afterwards.
SPEAKER: M8
You realize what a fool you've been to put yourself into such a position. But to working in the steelworks it's always dangerous and the one colleague of mine got hurt quite badly. Uh when one of these enormous ladle spilled both Misty camera crew was injured had it did an interesting film. We're talking about stable with poor Dixon quote from stone into steel which was the whole process from the iron ore to the finish uh product of steel girders without any commentary on live music.
SPEAKER: F9
Paul had been an edit to himself and yes and he did a number of very good documentary films. DAVID sings about a Welsh man and he teaches not a national film school hours a day.
SPEAKER: M8
The interesting series for NBC again they called it a wisdom serious interviewing elderly people old people.
SPEAKER: F5
So did Sean on Casey Ben Gurion.
SPEAKER: F4
Deborah had a do not do anyone else.
SPEAKER: M3
Animated was a whole series.
SPEAKER: F2
I didn't do all of it to host serious but those which were in Europe and Israel were given to his on that Ben Cohen in interview at our state of film Israel set called Cradle of genius which was the story of the epicenter in Dublin and I met many of the old actors Patrick Fitzgerald and again Sean or Casey and it was they hadn't seen each other for 20 years.
SPEAKER: F9
Vatican standard was the first Joxer and Sean case just play and it was really touching to see the two old men embracing each other for the first time in 20 years. That Juno and the peacock. Yes. Now they come to the sixties and that is the film in India on the electrification of India with an Indian director who had worked for the shadow film unit here and who knew me because I had did some filming for the show on many occasions.
SPEAKER: M8
And I was the only port on the Indian crew to film us for the age.
SPEAKER: F5
It was cold in those days a big electrical company in London who had interests in India.
SPEAKER: M3
And we travelled from Kashmir down to my house and from Bombay cross to Calcutta. And it was wonderful for me because I could ask questions and I had these Indian friends who could answer them.
SPEAKER: F2
It is such a wonderful British uh interesting fascinating country India for me. Different world altogether. I was very lucky to have been on this assignment. And did you bring your own cameras and so on or was supplied by I think about supplied and India yes. I have added nexus there and India has a vast film industry. I'm the biggest in the world if not the biggest and Nevada still has a fantastic audience. Film goes and so that act let alone inhabited a studio from his brother who died who was a famous Indian actor in the studio and he had to make feature films and even feature films later on but he was a very good documentary film maker and I was in touch with him over for many years.
SPEAKER: F3
Like the other films I did another film Miss Roth in fifty seven record. Cat and Mouse.
SPEAKER: M3
Film this had a warped quote about a story in Norway a short shortish film and the film later in a and I do this. How do you write quote The Boy Who Loved courses it was mainly meant for children.
SPEAKER: M7
And my next British feature film was the small world of Sammy Lee is Anthony Newley.
SPEAKER: F2
Can you start acting enough that that John Mortimer play called Lunch Hour which was directed by James. Again shot and met at the bond studios. Most of it and on location and Robert Stevens done by Allen productions still exist. The producer at lan my memory is not all that bad but he is still about go.
SPEAKER: M3
Yes or and I made a film in Malaya and a short little film which has won many prizes called snow for the railways with Jeffrey Jones dedicating and during the very hard went mountain 63 uh it was a short cut to music about clearing the railways from snow and get it keeping going it was really a.
SPEAKER: M4
Classical convention. The brilliant dinosaur. In fact when I was growing up film school we used to show it to the students. An example of how to make that kind of documentary.
SPEAKER: M3
Yes. Well I. It was very well down then unfortunately.
SPEAKER: M5
Jeffrey Jones never did much like um his uh Mom I'm not doing anything until his father retired because it wasn't directly for the coal board unit was it it was a commission and not the coal outside of the transport. They didn't use their own unit.
SPEAKER: M7
No no no.
SPEAKER: M4
They could take a commission check it comes to do it then there was this the American director I remember came to see me and I sort of hoped to fix them up. Who's they fanatically keen on shooting James Joyce's Ulysses. He work on that.
SPEAKER: M3
That's right. Have. Come on man on that. It was an early CinemaScope film black and white.
SPEAKER: M6
And in those days we only had uh supplementary lenses to the standard to give you the animal fic effect and we had quite a bit on top of it of cutting it on the edges and things like that. Did you threw them in front of you. Yes yes yes.
SPEAKER: F5
That was of course shot in Dublin or on location B. It was a very enjoyable film to do again.
SPEAKER: F3
We had wonderful the Irish actors. Now I remember my first fetish film it was Michael but and this we had right popular Jeff wood and it Milo Shaye of course had.
SPEAKER: F2
To do the lead and did it not Nick right. But uh Roy uh the actor.
SPEAKER: F1
Pre raves many good actor that was in 1966 Joseph Patrick directed it and produced it was an honest attempt I think at an impossible task to translate this uh wonderful book of poetry and to film.
SPEAKER: M4
Did you do any shots in the breeze to do so.
SPEAKER: M7
Oh no I'm okay. It was all on location.
SPEAKER: M4
Even the soliloquy. Yes Mother.
SPEAKER: F2
Yes. It took over the house an empty house. And turned it into Bloom's house. And it was all shot them on location. We had some uh people some electricians from here uh. Operator was on that ish uh. Man who is now camera man. But this was from England uh focus Porter which also cameraman now Derek.
SPEAKER: F4
That was Alan and did you manage to get the original sun most days.
SPEAKER: M4
Did it have to have to be revised.
SPEAKER: F2
No. Most of it was original sand. Chris Ranga was the sound man.
SPEAKER: F3
He managed to get some wonderful sound after that.
SPEAKER: M3
I went back to uh documentaries again after your says did a film on carbon with Peter Norman video which won the gold medal I believe.
SPEAKER: F2
And to sum up two films one about uh which was directed by Dudley Shaw Ashton um. Um Anthony Brown was the uh expert on it but the commentary. Bench camera so did you do it all. No I was at the door on uh recording the camera. Oh then the cameras. Yes. And it was shot at them. But uh who. They have in the National Gallery a series of seven plus size had some difficult to lacking it because uh there was no has beat them and is old paintings uh mustn't be exposed to any critique. So they had to employ uh industrial blow us bro code and on to the pictures we filmed them where they did their heads up.
SPEAKER: M4
No no at didn't. No.
SPEAKER: F6
But he was a.
SPEAKER: M3
And uh a while after that in nineteen sixty eight. I did a very nice one called Ring of Bright Water that had an American director who had worked with Disney on Disney's series of major films.
SPEAKER: F2
His name was Dick Colfer he was very knowledgeable about animals the actors were Virginia McKenna and they were Travis we shot it old in Scotland or on location again there were some studio shots in London but not many think only two things to escape.
SPEAKER: M5
Did you if you had more than one author presume you have.
SPEAKER: M3
Yes we have. Uh I think a thousand We had animal handlers from the states who pathetic the new because autos or although they look very playful or quite dangerous animals that came back to this thing quite easily.
SPEAKER: F9
And anyway every event are supposed to handle them because if you are too friendly with an animal which you use in the film it comes to that to you it comes to the cameraman instead of to the actor. So on that act this man allowed to touch stand and watch that's so very important principle. That the crew should not be familiar to anyone. And did you mostly use natural lighting where possible. Yes. And somebody collect this perhaps.
SPEAKER: M3
If the same detector and a little uh. Some years later I did uh the sequel to Born Free which was called living free.
SPEAKER: F2
And again we had 22 lions and most of them came from the States. They shot it in uh Kenya in Marcia some came from the emperor of Abyssinia of the Atlantis tribe lions and again the same principle uh. Those. Uh impressed on us that we shouldn't be too friendly which demands it was difficult because it comes from a very attractive young says again. We had uh animal handlers from the state from uh California. Some of the Lions came from probably the same from California because uh. In Africa you are discouraged from bringing up tame lambs. You are discouraged to pick up a cub if you find one in the bush because the chances are that the mother just left it dead anyway and would return to it. The statue's gone hunting and would return to the cub and because it's such a problem to release uh a lion which is uh was brought up by human beings and this used to human beings that was in the sense the theme of these films. Yes. Yes. So the land had to be imported.
SPEAKER: M5
If you're interested in zoology keeps cropping up again.
SPEAKER: M3
Yes. Yes.
SPEAKER: F4
Luckily yes but before I did that I think I did another feature anyway.
SPEAKER: F10
I did uh Entertaining Mr Sloane in 1969 which was uh directed by Don Hitchcock's had Lou Reed Peter McKendry and um had in there was the wonderful it had interest and lovely actors and wonderful dialogue. Oldman And that has become quite a kite film I believe.
SPEAKER: M7
I believe. Or on location again.
SPEAKER: M4
Did the dead Jewel come down on this as a tool.
SPEAKER: M7
No I don't think he was alive anymore. Was out the yes that was even enjoy with him to come to and after that after some other. I'm. Off to film again about your daughter and. To.
SPEAKER: F7
Some more documentaries to get caught. I worked on Cape Cod which was up by Mike Hodges and produced the Magic Kingdom which was shot in New Castle on location had Michael Caine in it.
SPEAKER: F1
It serious synthetic of actors.
SPEAKER: M6
That was one of the first film shot up north and has a very good story and is still considered to be one of the best sort of thriller films made on location. And you didn't use any studio or not video. And where was it supposed to be. Or didn't know what it was. Yes. Yes. There was a scene or two here in London because the Michael Caine character came from London to New Castle to find out who killed his brother. And we had a scene here in London or some location.
SPEAKER: F10
And that was their pool unit presumably. Yes. That was a pretty large unit of this distributed.
SPEAKER: M6
Uh and Jan had been a little publicity in the States. Unfortunately Michael King was very sore about them.
SPEAKER: F1
Jan not giving him any publicity for the film in the States. So it didn't make much money.
SPEAKER: M4
Probably making its money for pizza and then take it to the vision match.
SPEAKER: M6
I hope so. Yes.
SPEAKER: M7
And you continued meanwhile to keep on with your documentaries based documentaries work and and commercials came in. For me yes. I had met Dr. Hitchcock's commercials which uh. He was part of your last draft and I did a lot of commercials for them. Some with him some that poor Dixon or so well.
SPEAKER: M6
Bye. Used for Dixon. Poor Dixon was a and on commercials in those days.
SPEAKER: M7
But and did uh small music fast with Dr. Hickox quite a bit Chris.
SPEAKER: F10
They basically kept a better size which was another great success which was shot in the head. That and then entertaining Mr Sloane I'm jumping about the bit. I'm sorry. And continue to make uh short films and uh documentaries. A bit of film with Peter Finch caught something to hide again produced by Mac Klinger and dedicated by NASA. Read that and had Peter Finch and Shelley Winters at which was mainly shot at uh on the Isle of Wight but we did a couple of things at Shepperton after that uh and after some more documentaries I did another film this of Hitchcock's quote theater of production which was a spoof from uh horror films. Apparently about on that. Uh.
SPEAKER: F11
Mac. The sort of Donald Dumbledore type takes his revenge on critics by mail during one after the other.
SPEAKER: M6
I kept up my documentary today so it was off the that and the occasional commercials until I did a series of personal damage that it did that first three seasons Felicity Summers is James Hill. That acting. Uh that was a Southern Television great fun to make these wonderful actors. Uh Jim prepped. We um. Do you want us pubs and guests like this for every episode. And the shot does in Hampshire on location beautiful countryside lovely stories by case Waterhouse and very pleasant to work on.
SPEAKER: F11
Uh Jerry and this is I'll put it up for a long time. And uh after that. After that I uh got a chance to do a film program out of TV called Staying on which was a back. Poor Scott man. Uh the series. The press probably of the jewel in the Crown Books. You did it have little bill and not it Thanos that actor. Uh producer of his acting show Vic and it was shot in Simla. Uh he had a main leak from all the crew the electricians checking them out. The only outside ones uh my operator and myself.
SPEAKER: M7
It because jet engineers who operated shut down 16 metal you know with Trevor Trevor Howard and Celia Johnson who hadn't worked together since uh a brief encounter wonderful film. Yes. It was a wonderful wonderful script.
SPEAKER: F11
I really should probably say so but uh we had some trouble with the director who wasn't quite up to it whether it was the camera at it was 6000 feet sometimes and feet up but much of the directing was left to the operator myself I must the.
SPEAKER: M4
But just then the job was one of touching real.
SPEAKER: M7
While we had these great actors. Yes indeed. And a good story. And uh of course it was rather hard for the television crew to be dumped in England in India. Some of them had never left England before.
SPEAKER: F8
Some of them had never left Manchester they set up was new to me.
SPEAKER: M7
I had never worked for a television company before. It was really the electricians who ruled the roost.
SPEAKER: M10
They had made an agreement. Without asking me. Uh. Probably that that actor that day would start at 9:00 in the morning. Now in the tropics is the best Sun has between 7:00 in the morning and 10 sunset so by the time they got to location it was 10 or half past and the sun was right up above. And you get these deep shadows under the eyes and the eyes. So I suggested couldn't we uh alter this agreement. Uh no. That would have to be done by the shop steward in Manchester. So I suggested couldn't be cable that substitute in Manchester and get him to agree to that. No he would have to come out to India to do that that was the sort of thing I had to take to grips I couldn't have a load that I didn't want to grips as it happened but he had had uh an element from Bombay and it came. Business for grips we looked after things that looked like and one of them was an excellent grip and we hardly ever used milder Clay again. I probably shouldn't say it is.
SPEAKER: F12
I've got into trouble with the union in Manchester. On the other hand uh spots got us a lot of money out of Ghana but we got hardship money because they didn't have the Lancashire hotspots and things like that to eat up in the Himalayas and uh because a lot of overtime.
SPEAKER: M7
So we did better on that account of the hardships I couldn't obtain a stepladder for instance for the limitations that just didn't exist. The only step right that led out we had was for the construction crew who had to work ahead of us on the next location. So the sparks could never put up a lamp for me.
SPEAKER: F12
Higher than the standard two or.
SPEAKER: M5
It was very difficult to land it and no system do it. It could have fun do it. Some kind of is that better than just. No it didn't cost them and some I'm not apparently still as you say they got it down and it looks quite good.
SPEAKER: M4
Not very good. Uh how did you get on with Trevor.
SPEAKER: M10
Oh marvellously. He behaved very well. The um. Um he was on his best. Probably because of Celia. And we all fell in love with her. She was such a sweet moment and she moved us to tears.
SPEAKER: F8
And a pretty hard to put on paper but she was really great.
SPEAKER: M8
Well after that I went back to some more votes.
SPEAKER: M10
Look at Mitch and um did another film with James Hill in Wales called Rankin door about the last Welsh prince who fought the English. Shot that in two languages and Welsh and then English which presented great difficulties for the actors because they lack English text and of course the Welsh text is not a literal translation of the English text. So they have to read Lamb for the next take the Welsh takes and some actors have not got enough Welsh to make it really easy for them. They had to have a Welsh director as well as James central to that Irish pub because James couldn't understand what the actors were saying so it was quite uh an interesting experiment.
SPEAKER: F3
I had never done that before yes ma'am.
SPEAKER: M7
Next uh feature for television. What's good and bad at games with debt.
SPEAKER: F6
Go directing. What kind of production was that.
SPEAKER: M10
That was uh Portman quintet uh productions so it was an independent production but it's uh for Channel 4 I believe that tie up is September with another location that was another location film.
SPEAKER: F12
Yes. Or location. Where did you shoot at. Around London.
SPEAKER: F11
Um it took uh uh uh French. This is another six months for us.
SPEAKER: F12
We took over a former school building and shot most of it. Uh and there was the full length. Oh yes. Dick Durbin produced it.
SPEAKER: F11
And after that I did another film Miss James Hill caught a young visit this with uh Tracy or mom and some pretty good actors in that it was a famous book written by a girl of nine not twelve nine I think nine a little classic in the English literature.
SPEAKER: F12
And we had some excellent actors and we shot it around London then some of the stately homes and uh so it turned out well and Joyce watching it anyway and after that um I worked on the chain with Jack go over it again.
SPEAKER: M7
Written by Jack Rose and Tyler and must allow us know.
SPEAKER: F12
Well I did one other feature after that which had much never so if I had as far as I know cold cruelty a story in five and that was the last feature film that it and since then I've done mainly commercials and short films before I get some for video arts for junkies assignment scientific but mainly commercials training films did you do. Yes.

End of Side 2

SPEAKER: M1
Wolfgang that since she's Jet Skis side three.
SPEAKER: M2
Hey I wanted to ask you about your parallel career as a photographer. Which I believe you've kept up through the years. When did you first for instance uh have an exhibition of any sort. Uh the shared.
SPEAKER: M5
Oh no not until uh my late life really. Um I kept up photography uh partly as a hobby because I liked doing it partly to earn a living. I did a lot of uh freelance work. I photographed a lot of children portraits. I photographed a lot of animals and uh managed to settle them because in those days there were a few people who photographed animals as individuals as animal portraits if you like. They're uh usually photographs of uh specimen uh you had to see four legs and you didn't get animal portraits. And around the time probably two or three people uh beside myself who did that kind of thing and uh I found uh there was a market for it and people liked it. Uh I acted contribute to books. I did read some books.
SPEAKER: M9
I wrote a book for the studio publishers called photographing children. And there's another book called photographing animals. I did a number of children's books books for children.
SPEAKER: F6
Uh this color illustrations and kept it up until uh this day.
SPEAKER: F3
I wanted to make a book while I was working and so I wanted to make a book on the Charing Cross Road for instance and uh stopped it to take a series of pictures that my free time evenings um. Uh during fog and in the rain and uh in the snow.
SPEAKER: M9
And I tried to find a publisher. I had a very good writer of German uh write the code. Peter the Mendelssohn who was going to write the text for the book but you couldn't find a publisher. It was in those days very expensive to make photographic books and uh publishers were very reluctant to do anything about it.
SPEAKER: F2
Very few published.
SPEAKER: M12
Yes you have given up hope for it.
SPEAKER: M8
I not entirely. I find now that those pictures I took fifty years ago in the Charing Cross Road are being appreciated. And the German publisher is going to also publishers in this country is going to publish a little book in a series of historical photographs of London. He published a book of 0 platypus pictures.
SPEAKER: F3
Is in fact uh fellow cameraman and friend and that should come out in a week now.
SPEAKER: M16
So you were friendly with zero 0 Oh yes.
SPEAKER: M2
He also made many of these.
SPEAKER: M5
Yes yes indeed yes. But sometime after I had left it yes he was a very good photographer not altogether a very sensitive man and I loved him and published a book with Julian Huxley about memos called The Kingdom of the beast that was in nineteen fifty seven I believe. How did you get on with Julian. Oh I got on very well with him. There was a marvelous man who could talk on any subject who had great interest in the arts.
SPEAKER: F9
He was of course uh well versed in literature.
SPEAKER: M5
I met his brother our other half brother or us and photographed them together and I was became sort of the House photographer of the Huxley. I photographed his children and his wife who is still very first lady Huxley and her 80s now.
SPEAKER: M6
And what was it his nephew with visiting the zoo magazine.
SPEAKER: M9
No not that that was. So that was edited by a man called culture.
SPEAKER: M10
I thought at one time there was a Huxley on the geographic and magazine it was on the geographic.
SPEAKER: M16
I think it was a cousin I remember zoo magazine because it was one of the ones my father was the manager of that Adams place. Uh huh. And you did quite a lot of photography for that. Yes yes. Commissioner made two pictures and knows about pictures which I had taken before. Also one of his other papers is that illustrated that you would give you would work not with animals because you do not know.
SPEAKER: M5
But I did quite a lot of.
SPEAKER: M9
They gave me quite a lot of assignments as a photojournalist also for picture posted a bit and did you.
SPEAKER: M6
Where are you conditioning to go on our own stories or you just said right here.
SPEAKER: F3
Yes I was commissioned to do some stories for them and uh to the editor was a man called Spooner and of our and a well-known photographer Staff Josh.
SPEAKER: F2
And uh I did it for Jim Jim Jones.
SPEAKER: M7
Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER: F3
I also got commissioned by the Sunday Times and The Observer for pictures and wrote for a magazine called photography which was edited by Norman Hoar who was later did it of the Times and Sunday Times. And a man from Adams became let out editor of The Observer.
SPEAKER: F1
I can't remember his name at the moment but it'll come back to me.
SPEAKER: M8
So still photographer and I now find the pictures that took 50 years ago really being appreciated because things have changed in London.
SPEAKER: F3
Some even a couple that have been made as posters and postcards and selling quite well clandestine.
SPEAKER: M12
Would it be true to say that you are much fond of and posed photographs of waiting for the right moment rather than a in particular.
SPEAKER: M5
Yes that's absolutely so.
SPEAKER: M22
As I said before I don't like to tell people what to do and I avoid arranging things of course I do make a suggestion or I sit and look this way or that way or settle in another chair or whatever but I don't avoid arranging things and I rather take things as they are and choose the right moment.
SPEAKER: M12
On the other hand is your natural skills resume and your training that although you did pose them the obvious they are usually very well composed.
SPEAKER: M8
Well that is yes.
SPEAKER: M5
So about 90 percent of the success of a portrait for instance is the sitter. And there's only about 5 percent. The photographer and now the 5 percent is luck.
SPEAKER: M6
Actually I think it's very important to be able to get your sister to behave naturally.
SPEAKER: F3
Yes. One tries to make some contact. Of course best to set down some understanding between you and the sitter through the years both in your still work and your movies.
SPEAKER: M6
You come. You've met many very interesting people.
SPEAKER: M11
Yes indeed. And especially in documentaries. Yes.
SPEAKER: M4
We did a marvelous thing about our job is that you get into so many various places and meet so many various people.
SPEAKER: F1
An ordinary citizen never gets in a steel into a steel box or down a coal mine or into uh chemical factory into an operating center and b frequently went into these places and we met the leading X experts and exponents I met uh Fleming and I met uh Bragg and Blackett and uh I met politicians like Ben Gordon and I got out and uh president and panache and Nehru and um that is really the wonderful thing about our job and it's never the same as where every set up is a new problem which makes life challenging and interesting in the sense in the shots where such people are being interviewed.
SPEAKER: M6
It is not so far removed from your portrait photography in indeed.
SPEAKER: F3
Yes. Uh so very much. I mean this is the same thing and it's the same kind of boat of China's turns.
SPEAKER: M6
In a way you're almost near the center in the sense that the director is an occasion.
SPEAKER: M8
You say Well uh maybe but uh director uh has until you uh steer the conversation and uh asked hard questions do you find that many people want to consult you about how do they look.
SPEAKER: M21
They sometimes seem to be worried about.
SPEAKER: M10
Oh yeah. Right. Are they looking in the right way. And so while actresses do Leslie especially.
SPEAKER: F3
But uh they have confidence in the camera man. Usually it's only a very big stars like man in Detroit who had a special camera man for her close. He did nothing else but close ups who traveled with her but never worked on pictures like that because it was a very good meal ticket for certain cameramen who convinced certain stars that only they could make them look young and beautiful.
SPEAKER: M6
And they were able to command very high salaries.
SPEAKER: M10
Well the stars knew because they saw themselves on the screen.
SPEAKER: F4
Could we interrupt for a moment to say you were saying that you had had some exhibitions but only later in your life.
SPEAKER: M11
Yes I had some uh it offered for instance used some of my pictures in that gallery in Hoboken in the old days. Uh no children mainly but my very first big exhibition was not until uh 1982 at the photographer's gallery. They gave Meredith's respective exhibition and uh this year I had another exhibition at the Camden Art Center. Again a very varied exhibition of pictures from all over the world.
SPEAKER: M3
Which was which were chosen by the director of the gallery and another photographer lady uh out of my collection of pictures.
SPEAKER: M11
But uh those were the only two big exhibitions I've ever had.
SPEAKER: M12
You keep paid. Presumably your negatives. Through the years.
SPEAKER: M13
Yes yes. I have uh a large number of negatives to uh photographers Gallery a selling some of my pictures.
SPEAKER: M4
You can buy prints there um they are still being used in publications now and then but most of my work is black and white. I prefer working in black and white. So my animal pictures are not used to a large extent anymore because they have been replaced by color pictures and uh wildlife photography and mainly which I have done little only in Africa. I did some while I was working on living free for instance and also before that on a documentary in Kenya. I stayed on for another three days and maintain a photographic safari on both occasions well perhaps with the revival of interest in black and white.
SPEAKER: M6
For instance the independent Saturday magazine and the new ways of reproducing black and white. Using all the colors and with this marvelous reproduction so they may be looking round nowadays for more black and white photographs.
SPEAKER: M11
Again I feel yes I have become quite uh the fashion again black and white photographs.
SPEAKER: M13
There is a gallery a coat of black and white scholars who publish two of my pictures as large posters and also published a number of postcards that is quite an interest in black and white photography.
SPEAKER: M6
Did you do your own developing and printing rooms.
SPEAKER: M14
Yes I oversee that mound developing in print and I think that's important because only you yourself know how to interpret the negative. What you mean. Magic was meant to look like but this becomes more difficult in color. This becomes more difficult in color and also unless you do it all the time the chemicals don't keep that long. You can't do that. Uh on just on occasions going to the darkroom and kind of printing it's not set.
SPEAKER: M6
Have you made films in color.
SPEAKER: M14
Oh yes. Yes indeed. All films uncut. Now where do they come to me now. Sometimes for commercials. I'm black in black and white because I still remember how it was done.
SPEAKER: M3
I still know how to use filters and so I did reason. Last year I did a big commercial for a risque company of Canadian cab for the cinema the biggest Latin job I've ever done. I had to let the whole person in the docks. There was a big ship unloading crates of whisky. It was set in the prohibition time because that's how Canadian Club made their first money. Shipping from Canada to the states across the lakes and there was a boat chase and the boat was blown up and all that sort of thing all at night. So there was an enormous lighting job. We did much to the annoyance of local residents who didn't appreciate the gunfire and their children and wanted to sleep.
SPEAKER: M7
You had cause gunfire. The Journey's Don't make quite so much noise as they used to.
SPEAKER: M13
Now that has improved a lot. Altogether the improvements I have seen.
SPEAKER: M11
We can talk about that how tremendous especially an emotion technique and in optics.
SPEAKER: M3
The first colour film as I remember. I forget what the monarch pack it was called on a back first. After that silly pack uh Technicolor. Uh I think uh 64 is a tungsten light and 40 and uh Mr. filter daylight. And today we have films up to five hundred.
SPEAKER: F4
Did you ever work with technicolor. I never worked this is true. Camera's not Did you ever try to fake color. No I never did. No.
SPEAKER: M16
Won't what improvements have you seen. It seemed to be the most important in optics prints and lenses and so forth.
SPEAKER: M4
Well the zoom lens of course which you came in in when did it come in in the 50s.
SPEAKER: M18
Yes yes. Except for newsreels. But then it was from 6 inches to 12 inches. Well before the war and they weren't very good. Did I have them before the war.
SPEAKER: F1
Yeah but long focused ones for the newsreels had the mother and uh the general quality of lenses the definition to have uh. It is especially important for a 60 millimeter and a fine grained emotions we have nowadays. So sixteen medals really only came in uh into its own. So those technical developments and Super 16 you can blow up to four cinema exhibition without anybody knowing it almost so there has been tremendous development. Also cameras have improved a great deal.
SPEAKER: M7
There's really cameras stayed much the same for many years didn't they.
SPEAKER: M13
Yes the Mitchell camera lasted 50 years or more on this still being made in the same way.
SPEAKER: M1
I think almost the same movement as you know difference in technique filming for television between television and see. And. I don't.
SPEAKER: M19
Find much much difference. Uh one tends to stay away from long shots landscape shots on television because the definition hasn't got enough out on the whole right. I don't take much notice such a difference. Years think. Yes. Well that of course you have to bear in mind. Yes.
SPEAKER: M1
That suggests a different format. You have to have a press conference.
SPEAKER: M14
That doesn't apply anymore because the best images on television is still live. Feature films which they show.
SPEAKER: M20
But I wish that had been working with you and I first did some first for television because the cameramen were handed out with a very complicated list of things about not a dark area on the bottom left handed. Also had a nonsense of that sort. And I always use it because it was the beginning of an Reeder fusion and they were shooting a film and it was like a bus garage. You had it often had a different camera man every day. And I used to always tear up these instructions. Listen you can't do that. That's it. What did you enjoy last week most. It was always a feature film is that they didn't have the rules. So I think a lot of these rules were unnecessary.
SPEAKER: M11
Would you. No sir. I'm sure there were unnecessary ask.
SPEAKER: M4
It was because engineers were in charge of transmitting and they still are but that didn't have the courage they wanted to play safe unless the graphics on their instruments were up to said that they thought it was wrong if they in other words the perfect picture was a medium gray yes with nothing on it.
SPEAKER: M19
That's yes we have progressed since then and television to Rome and yes some marvelous but done on color television even life drama which is ran out of his. You rarely see a really badly photographed uh program on TV except for some of the sitcoms that I don't take much care.
SPEAKER: M7
Is that still have that sort of general overall. Yeah I think so. It doesn't matter where they go what they do. Yes. But you've never. You've never done any tape shooting have you for television.
SPEAKER: M14
I have done quite a bit on tape. Plus I did some for video art. Some tape and uh do commercials on tape occasionally.
SPEAKER: M19
And again their cameras have improved a great deal. Now you have uh sort of state cameras which uh can cope with that.
SPEAKER: F1
When does that sort of thing which do tube cameras then come can't but you can see what you are doing.
SPEAKER: M13
Uh while you're doing it so uh it's I find it very easy to land for the.
SPEAKER: M7
Would you be watching a monitor. And having through the camera.
SPEAKER: M13
Oh yes yes yes. Under through the camera you only get a monochrome picture anyway. That is another thing which has come in. We have video assist on film cameras. Now coming in in color.
SPEAKER: M7
And so far they're mainly black and white but added flicks have just come out with a color assessed it seems strange that it's taking so many years I remember 30 years ago or more that they did have those can be flexes for instance made up at Reed fusion with a monitor on. But then nobody seemed to bother with it for a long time.
SPEAKER: M14
Well commercial people liked it because the clients can see what goes on and uh the director can see exactly the framing. So it is quite useful.
SPEAKER: M7
I think many ask you about framing before. It is sometimes uh we have a slight worry is it not that when you are making a film which is going to have both uses it's going to be shown on the more or less wide screen in the theater and also on the television. So the composition really is not common. Sometimes we write for both kind of.
SPEAKER: M14
No it can't be right for us because unfortunately television don't show it. That could easily crop top and bottom a little bit at least.
SPEAKER: F1
It's never quite right and they have to juggle during the um pretty rehearse set to show off from a widescreen film. It's always a compromise.
SPEAKER: M7
Bound to be but of course the the the anomalies they often show the CinemaScope film they switch for the beginning and end titles. Yes to the right shape during the Black tough and button is pretty satisfactory but they just can't bring themselves to let that happen all the way through. That's right.
SPEAKER: F1
They don't think the public would like it and then they pay for a complete picture and month that picture has but very usually bad man television and uh compose so that it can be cropped. Yeah it's.
SPEAKER: M7
But at least you can't leave things hanging around that area in between such as microphones dangling or anything like that.
SPEAKER: F2
Yes yeah yeah.
SPEAKER: M13
Well there's less progress is. The working conditions I find it terrible that people have to work these long hours nowadays if you are engaged you have to promise to work 10 hours and it's often much more and you have to promise to work six days a week and laugh and that great step back that sings fathers almost fought on the barricades for like an eight hour day should be completely lost in our industry.
SPEAKER: M7
Yes. Would you agree that sometimes it's the unions or the workers who are blamed for the amount of money that paid when the original arrangement was not necessarily designed to get us a lot of money but to to persuade employers not to work you for 24 hours a day.
SPEAKER: M14
Yes indeed but uh.
SPEAKER: M4
You just have to agree and uh the unfortunate thing is that now you get one contract to show today John Young and another one you get a letter saying uh what are real conditions are. And I think it's all wrong.
SPEAKER: M19
And the union has lost its power and I'm sure that the result would be better if people are not exhausted would not be forced to work these long hours and six days a week seven days on location sometimes.
SPEAKER: M21
Well this is what we found in the days before the war that the quality was going down from everything the actors couldn't act for these long hours. Technicians make mistakes. Yes it does look tired and very often it just leads to total inefficiency.
SPEAKER: M19
Well the producers said the high costs of everything starting from the actors marginally. Maybe they have to have stars or get a lot of money through the equipment and they can't save on technicians because they have to pay. Well not if you have to agree to 10 12 hours a day ten twelve hour day without overtime.
SPEAKER: F8
I don't think in any other way to save money by doing that perhaps they didn't really save money in the long run.
SPEAKER: M7
The answer used to be that they didn't get the scripting done properly and that's it. Do you think that's too often the cause.
SPEAKER: M19
That can't be it. What is the scheduling. So instead of scheduling for four weeks that should be scheduled for six weeks but then to have to pay the actors for six weeks I suppose. It costs like how we're going to get back to human conditions of work.
SPEAKER: F4
I don't know if ever. Well it doesn't look very hopeful with all these new that's moving on in the cable and so forth. No certainly not until now.
SPEAKER: M4
They insist on non-union labor because now I think the whole trade union movement will have to start from the bottom again.
SPEAKER: M19
And get renewed membership and forces.
SPEAKER: M7
In other words it will only work when the members themselves begin to realize that it's not that they suffer this way.
SPEAKER: M4
So when unions started because in the old days uh long before the all they had to sleep in the studio because they had to be there worked until midnight and had to be on the set again at 8:00 in the morning.
SPEAKER: M3
They couldn't even go home. And that's when they start unions started to negotiate conditions yes at first it was conditions that we weren't able to do much about salaries.
SPEAKER: M7
But we did manage to start fighting for conditions that and theoretically that's still supposed to happen set down features isn't it. There's a preproduction meeting and you're supposed to obey all the rules but obviously you don't think it's happening on.
SPEAKER: M19
I don't think it does. No it doesn't happen about hours. It doesn't happen about crewing even because sometimes cameramen operate the camera on commercials sometimes the director operates the camera usually badly and an operator can contribute such a lot of film.
SPEAKER: F8
Commercial I just uh despair at the State of the industry at the moment but they still make good pictures.
SPEAKER: F1
So somehow people get over it. Film we saw last night was beautifully done.
SPEAKER: M18
Yes and quite cheaply. I suppose I imagine what it was called summertime. Of course about this story. I think it was called the apple tree originally in the store.
SPEAKER: F1
I don't know. Script was by Penelope Mortimer and so it was a medical picture.
SPEAKER: M7
Do you enjoy lighting and color. Yes. Do you still prefer black and white.
SPEAKER: M3
No. No I enjoy Latin for color and it's easier to light for color.
SPEAKER: M4
I'm not decrying color. Color can contribute a lot especially in film.
SPEAKER: F1
It can create a mood.
SPEAKER: M21
You can create more characters you have a clever art director there's not been a great deal of selective use of color has it's fairly rare. Yeah. Deliberately going for everything being sort of autumnal colors though. As a painter might some and have done it but it's not common is it.
SPEAKER: F7
No but there was this uh lovely film Miss Katherine Hepburn and uh what's his name. American. Yes.
SPEAKER: M18
Oh the Golden Pond. Yes. And it was so cold. And Hitchcock did. And uh was it the top of his head. Uh yes. There's trouble with Harry and it's shot in New England. Yes.
SPEAKER: M10
Morton but there is plenty of scope for the future. Yes. And some directors who use the absence of color.
SPEAKER: F1
To get your facts John Boorman painted the whole street Gray and Leo the last Antonioni used to paint a lot of things too didn't it.
SPEAKER: M7
Yeah. Paint the grass a different color. That sort of thing.
SPEAKER: M18
Yes.
SPEAKER: F2
There is scope for using color imaginatively What is it.
SPEAKER: M7
I didn't know whether you have any other things you'd like to say anything of which you'd like to unburden yourself.
SPEAKER: M14
No no. I said have talked enough if not too much certainly not too much.
SPEAKER: M21
I feel you're very modest person about your accomplishments well I hope so.
SPEAKER: M18
As agreed as modest here. I don't like people who brag all the time. I know you don't. Have you suffered from preggers.
SPEAKER: M19
Not much. Some. Yes. Yes. There are directors who think they are the answer to our prayers. And uh I've even worked with that actor who resented any suggestion I made. I just said I want it that way. And that's it.
SPEAKER: M7
Do you find that on the average such people are those who really know the least.
SPEAKER: M13
Maybe. Yeah.
SPEAKER: F8
But um it just is bad manners to resent it and say you resent it. At least you can listen to people and then say no. So now I'll do it another way. This is just the way it's done.
SPEAKER: M7
It would it would seem foolish not to accept people's advice even if it's from the stage hand. It's always the students who have it. Yes I often get advice from my capable.
SPEAKER: F2
Anybody.
SPEAKER: M7
Do they generally operate on documentaries and documentaries.
SPEAKER: M4
I do. One thing I did want to say is justice occurs to me is that I prefer working in films to stateless work because it is a co-operative effort and you work with other people. And still photography is a very lonely job. You are your own electrician and your own assistant. I have never employed an assistant. Uh a lot of photographers do but in film you're always working together without us.
SPEAKER: F8
Because lot that I could have as a producer. I'm operate on an assistant and an assistant that I could. We all have to work together and and that's what I like about it.
SPEAKER: M21
Would you say that what you learned in the whole show in Vienna that that has to do in good stead.
SPEAKER: M4
It was a good club and a point to hedge or it was I had to rely on most practical things because it was much much of it was theater. And when you come out of school for photography it may be quite different nowadays and you sent on my job. You really have to work through experience. So I guess the answer is. Well that I think this was my ultimate statement. Even people who come out of the National Film School will have to gain practical experience. I think although they may be very good. But you have to learn how to work together and you have to learn uh to uh improvise and make.
SPEAKER: F4
Well thank you very much.

End of Side 3