Roger Davis

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Speaker 1  0:00  
My name is Roger Davis. And I'm down in deepest Somerset, which is the county where I was born and where I've been fortunate enough to retire. I now live in the city Cathedral City of wells, which is a great privilege of a beautiful place to, to retire to, I have to say. Right, if I can share the screen and then we can sort of illustrate what I'm talking about if that's okay. So we'll go there. So, hopefully you have you have a picture of the house that where I was born, do you have that okay.

Speaker 2  0:50  
looks it looks rather idyllic. Indeed, if

Speaker 1  0:55  
it was, I think I can claim to have a had an idyllic childhood. This, this house is, was a derelict farmhouse, which my parents bought when they married in 1932. It was called in before they bought it was called Rose farm. And the all the land had been sold away apart from the an acre or so of orchards and garden around it. During the Great Depression, you know, following the First World War, and as it was virtually derelict, they bought it and did it up. My father was the second son of a farming family that we can trace back to 1610. And they never moved more than from one parish to the other. There were two parishes side by side, near what is now Western Super Mare, which doesn't didn't exist in those days. That was a Victorian invention after the railways but so if you can imagine this very much farming open farming countryside, North Somerset, say my family, the earliest we can get back to was written records and 1610. And we have a continuous record. They were farmers, Yeoman farmers, I suppose. And no one ever moved. As far as we can see more than about a mile in any direction. As extraordinary until my father was the first one to move the way. And he moved all of six miles. But he, he and my mother, when they married, they bought this old farmhouse did it up, which was where I was born in 1936, which makes me 85 and a half now, that's a very interest. And I was the second son of four boys. And we grew up there went to the village school. And then after 11 Plus, we went by train to the local Grammar School in western Super Mare, which was, so it was a bike ride for a mile or so through the country, then a steam train ride and then a bus ride to school. So it was a interesting journey every day in both directions. And when they went on to a levels, which I did, I was sort of ScienceBase I got my my amateur radio licence, I'd always had an interest from very young child didn't electrical matters and so on. There was the farmer agenda we were surrounded by farms and the one opposite of the other literally the other side of the road where we've spent an awful lot of time with with with the cows and hay making and combine harvesting and all that sort of thing. We're attraction engines, doing the thrashing. You know, sort of all the sorts of stuff that you read about in storybooks. We have a river at the bottom of the garden with boats on so it does say that we're extremely fortunate that the farmer oppositely was unusual insofar he taken an interest in radio, went from its very earliest days, and he was the first person in our village to have a television set. Black and white, of course, in when I was, I suppose in my teens, he had the first television ever in the village. But he encouraged me in my electrical interests, and I went on to join while I was at the grammar school joined the local amateur radio society. I got my transmitting licence while I was still at school. And that thing you can see at the background there, there that is the top, the tower of my transmitting miles. So I eventually put up. This was my station. That's me up. There's about 1516. And this was my old home home built equipment. Apart from that, which was World War surplus, sort of radio that was used at Bletchley Park. There was an American radio receiver, ar 88, which was available. All my all my savings and pocket money went on that.

Unknown Speaker  5:38  
Was this at home, they Oh,

Speaker 1  5:42  
yes, was yes, this was in that in and we had a workshop in one of the rooms was the old dairy in the farmhouse that became a shared workshop with my brothers and I had a corner. And this was my bit. And in the in the orchard at the back. With the help of the farmer opposite. We put up this tower, he bought all sorts of government surplus, because you couldn't buy tractors in those days. So he bought things like old Bren gun carriers, cut the armour plating off and sold them to local farmers, distractors. And he bought a whole pile of government surplus towers that have been used for radar and things like that during the war, and gave me a couple of them which I used to put up rather fine, very enviable aerial for my amateur radio, which I could talk all around the world with.

Speaker 2  6:35  
Did you brothers and join him with this activity? No.

Speaker 1  6:39  
My older brother Michael. He was he was a mechanical engineer. He didn't. When he left school, he did an apprenticeship in Bristol with a very famous firm of retinal Dolman and Rogers, who are precision engineers. And then he he became a ship's engineer with Shell tankers. And then he went on to have a base case he saved all his money, because of course, you couldn't spend it because you were at sea all the time with oil tankers. And so he saved up and he when he came ashore, he bought up a derelict, well, almost derelict plating metal plating company in Bristol and built up the biggest plating company in the West of England. As of time he retired. He and his wife disappeared off to France the rest of their days. My brother Peter, younger, younger brother, Peter, he emigrated to Australia when he was 15, under the big brother scheme, sheep farming, and he went on to have a whole series of businesses out there and finished up with a blank banana plantation in New South Wales, and he's still out there. My younger brother, youngest brother, James, he was he went on to be a professional travel photographer. And all around the world had a huge travel library and many of his photographs so with big photographic libraries, like LME, and so on.

Speaker 2  8:06  
So quite diverse interests. Yes,

Unknown Speaker  8:09  
yes. Yes. He lives down in South Devon.

Speaker 2  8:13  
So was your father supportive? Or your mother as well?

Speaker 1  8:17  
They were marvellous. Really they let us do exactly where they wherever our instincts led us. They were not never directive that they were pleased with whatever we did. That seemed right for us. So our interests were very diverse in that that that way. But not know my father was very artistic. He was the Display Manager of one of the big fashion store in Bristol. He'd served his apprenticeship in Cheltenham with Cavendish house where you had to wear morning dress and nobody paid cash. It was all all accounts. And literally they rolled out red carpets for people arriving in their carriages and, and cars in the 1920s and 1930s. So, no. So that's that. So that that was chartered, then when I left school, there are some days of national service. Unfortunately, my parents weren't, weren't well off enough to pay for university fees. And in those days, Somerset was an Agricultural Council, and didn't think further education was a particularly good idea. So it was almost impossible to get to a county scholarship. So although I had three University places, I never actually went to university. I went I went into the RAF and signed on for an extra year. Because in today's national service, you you, you've got the job that happened to be needed at the time, so you might end up in the Cook house or In an office or whatever, but by signing on for three years rather than the statutory two, you could choose the service and choose the particular skill. So, obviously, with my radio interests, I joined the RAF. I had been in the Air Training Corps when I was at school, so that was a big advantage. And I chose to do Air Wireless. And so after square bashing, I was sent to RAF spray, which was number two radio school in in Wiltshire. There were three radio schools at the time at that time that the radio was number one was locking in western Vukmir. That was mainly apprentices to where I was sent was the biggest don't we had about 4000 trainees. At that time, this is in the 19, early 1950s. Remember, when the Cold War was at its height, so everyone was on military awareness. And I haven't done my basic training there. I was asked to join the permanent staff and to take on the responsibility of learning the very latest equipment which was a being given to the Wii vamos this was they were just being commissioned up until then, of course, the RAF was still flying Lancaster's. They got me to yours and vampires, a few jet planes, but they got no jet bombers. And of course, the threat from the Russia was immense at the time. And so the government commission these three, they were in competition with each other to see who which three different private companies and in the end, of course, the Vulcan tend to be the weapon of choice. So remember, it was used many years later, in the Falklands conflict. That's, that's the one of the that's this one here. Anyway, so I was asked to do the special training with the manufacturers, because the radio equipment was common to all three. And then my task was to train the aircrew who were going to fly these things, of course, they'd only been used to the equipment in the aircraft that were from the Second World War. So, it was a dramatic step change for them. And so, I that was me a mere Corporal teaching Wing Commanders and group captains and it was all quite fun. So, I had a very cushy time really. So this this is this is me and my instructors gear this is the equipment there's this assess book was known as it made by Senator telephones, it was all modular equipment channelise which was all completely new to to the RF at the time this was all test equipment. So, this was one I had to to borrow trees I built with with the equipment with benches with with a complete set of equipment as would be fitted in the aircraft as this bit this is just equipment because I was training the people who would go on to be responsible for servicing the aircraft that was my that was the main task. So I did partly conversion of aircrew lectures and also lectures training the the air fitters who will be responsible for putting the maintaining the equipment in the aircraft at the at the airfields where the aircraft were deployed. So sort of double. So anyway, that's, that's that.

Speaker 2  14:03  
It sounds like a lot of responsibility for you, man.

Speaker 1  14:08  
It's ridiculous, really, because I was only 18. But I suppose they must have, I suppose with my previous experience, really? I guess that's why they grabbed me and asked me to do this. So I had a very happy time in the RAF. So this

Speaker 2  14:26  
was virtually your your apprenticeship your university in well,

Speaker 1  14:30  
it was in a way yes, I had to write all textbooks. You know, the four four I had a another guy civilian instructor because the RAF in those days not only had service instructors, but also civilian instructors. And he'd also done the course with the manufacturers. So he and I, together wrote all the textbooks for the RAF for this equipment at the time. Now that's not me actually in the end. parked it at that. I was sent off for a week in 1956 or 57. I can't remember the every year in London at Earls Court they had a week's radio and television show which was for manufacturers to exhibit all their latest electronics and the RAF are the three forces the the Navy army and air force always have big stands. And I was asked to go and man the RAS and and that particular year the RAF chose to display the equipment they were using the Antarctic, there was a new Antarctic Expedition going on which the RAF were involved with. And this is the equipment that this is identical equipment that was being used in the Antarctic. So they mocked up what it would have been like in the Antarctic. I was expected to stand there and talk about it to the Joe Public. So that's why I'm looking a bit tidy in that picture.

Unknown Speaker  16:04  
Yeah, very dapper.

Speaker 1  16:05  
Yeah. I mean, in those days, of course, you didn't have pictures taken left, right and centre like they do these days. You know, you had a 35 mil camera. And you very carefully calculated whether or not you could afford to press the button, because it was almost expensive and you had to have it processed and so on. So that's why I don't have many photographs from those days. But this is one backup Tory a feud spree that's me. This is our amateur radio station we ran. And it says my great friend Gordon sharply. Yates free had two wings. One was for air radio, the sort of thing that I was teaching, and the other half was air, air radar. And Gordon was one of the instructors. On the air radar side, he was an absolute BrainBox. Very, very clever. And we both got demobbed more or less at the same time, I managed to get a job with the BBC. And Gordon went to work for Granada Television in Manchester, he lived in Manchester, so it was sort of natural, I suppose for him. So we both went into into television, broadcasting but on opposite sides, but we kept in touch with each other for many, many years until he died, sadly, at a very young age, but he was a pioneer with a lot of the things like video tape recording and so forth. He installed and ran the very first Ampex video recording machines in the UK ever had. And they cost 400,000 pounds each, in today's money. incredibly complicated. And his was the sort of guy they needed. Anyway, that was Gordon, there

Speaker 2  17:59  
seems to have been quite a close relationship between well, particularly the RAF, but the forces in general and the BBC that a lot of

Speaker 1  18:06  
it was it was a huge source of, of talent to say, yeah, if you know the RAF Standards and Training, particularly, I meet your dog, I see this

Unknown Speaker  18:23  
guest she's she's decided to come up and say hello.

Speaker 1  18:28  
Right? Yes. So when I joined the BBC, of course, all my fellow engineers for all done national at least done national service. And so there was we notice it when national service ended, let's put it that way. The lack of discipline, the lack of being able to take instruction, you know, when something needed doing and doing in a hurry, you didn't stop an argue you got on with it. We overtime, we just did the job until the job was done, you know, and it was very noticeable the way things change, you know, with all respect to the new recruits, but yet they hadn't been through that particular experience. Which I think I have to say, I enjoyed it and it was worth it. I didn't enjoy in the early days, of course, when it was square bashing and I think most people by and large, enjoyed and enjoyed the services. I certainly anyway, this is what not and Paul which anyone who's ever worked in BBC engineering will recognise this was the main staff training school. This this, this building was built by the one of the descendants of the The the royal family in France so do you do your door? The to door Orleans? Right? So the fleur de Leon thing all over the place is that that was a very extravagantly built. The BBC acquired it before the war and it became the secret headquarters of the BBC ends where they ran all the broadcasting farm in underground studios and so forth. A very hush hush. But of course, the BBC after or then turned it into their training school and engineers, both studios and broadcast stations and places like Sutton Coldfield, and Crystal Palace and so forth. All the all the engineers of BBC were trained there. And one of the first things that happened after you were recruited, you were sent there to do your initial training. And then if you were deemed good enough later on a year or two later you will be sent to do the advanced engineering course and engineering. So I did both of those at work not

Speaker 2  21:11  
geared towards radio or television or both.

Speaker 1  21:16  
I guess I think they did, right. Yes, they did do radio as well. Yes, of course. It did. Yes. Yeah. So though I was only involved with the television side, but there were you did did all aspects of engineering or the theoretical side, there are maths lessons and advanced maths lessons and so forth, as well as the actual technical stuff. And also did some workshop experience as well. Learning to do soldiering and all that sort of thing properly? If you hadn't if you couldn't already do it? You know, some of us good some of us couldn't depending on their background. Yeah. Excellent training of course.

Unknown Speaker  21:54  
Is this the bit that's now hotel sudden pop sorry, is this part of what northern that's now a hotel?

Speaker 1  22:03  
Yes, it's no the the BBC sold this the main has here and it's now a very, very luxurious hotel. You can see the top floor that was burned that caught fire and was burnt, whether it was before or just after the war, but the the hotel company that bought it they have restored all that. So that's all been rebuilt, but the BBC have kept the buildings at the back here. But the theme the main the main house has been sold away. In fact, my I took my wife there for an anniversary stay a couple of years ago. It was very strange going back and seeing the rooms in which I've been lectured. Sure, so tell it was great in Ostalgie IK. But yes, the back section is now fenced off as it were and the BBC still use that I understand. So that's what mortonhall on the strength of a BBC salary, I bought my first car. Austin Seven, all over the country in that Austin 719 32. So I broadcasts I've been to, I used to go up and down from Somerset, where my parents continued to live here to Birmingham up and down the associate before the motorway was built. If I had the weekend off, I've been up to them all over the Midlands into North all over Norfolk, up to up to Manchester and Aintree. Admitted many 1000s of miles did that car. And then I bought, then I traded in for a Volkswagen. And that was my amateur radio equipment I built to go and knit transmitter receiver so I can operate mobile, which was unusual in those days. But of course, I was in dig so in Birmingham, so I continued my amateur radio interests by operating from the car, and which was quite useful, particularly when I was on outside broadcasts, because you got to know the if you were, you know, billeted somewhere in Norfolk or wherever you got to live, talk to the local radio amateurs that kept that interest alive. Here we are at these I've just included a few shots from sort of BBC stuff because I've got a separate set of pictures for you of gosta green, presumably, which is really what you want to see. Lovely

Speaker 2  24:42  
what all of it I mean, this is all just fascinating. So

Speaker 1  24:47  
this is just just a picture of me with the NCR 10. That was our mobile control plan group that we had at Birmingham based at carpenter road.

Speaker 2  25:00  
So when when you did your training with Norton, were you then allocated to a centre? Well,

Speaker 1  25:07  
we Yes. After the the the way things worked is when you joined the BBC engineering. You were sent to London for about three weeks if I remember rightly. You'd have an introductory course at BH and across the road in the Langham. The Langham Hotel, which was part of again belong to the BBC in those days. So you have lectures and so forth at the Langham and then he was you went out on day visits to White City, shepherds, Bush, Lime Grove. And so you went around all the studios and got familiarised with the whole concept of broadcast television and so forth, so many different types of cameras and control units and so forth. And then then they sent you to wherever there was a vacancy, and I was sent to Birmingham. I mean, it was not question Where do you want to go? You went where you were sent. I mean, that was part of the agreement. And what year would this have been? 1956? I think yes. So I was sent to Birmingham now, in the regions, they'd only just started up. So everything was very informal. There. I say there was no unionisation. So everything was done on a sort of gentleman's agreement basis, which was made life extremely pleasant. And that is, I don't know whether it was true in the other regions within Birmingham. The arrangement for the engineer as far as you did three months in the studio's three months on base maintenance, I really know looking after all the equipment and repairing it, which was frequently required because it went wrong, an awful lot. And then three months on outside broadcasts, right. So you've rotated continually between student studios, maintenance, base maintenance, that carpenter road, and the OB unit MCR 10, which was marvellous to you, and then you've got to do everything you did Camera work by boom mic, sound mixing, vision, vision control, you had this huge experience, which of course they don't get these days, you do one job and one job only. But so here, this is me, rigging MCR 10 These are Marconi Mach two cameras, EMS 10 had an interesting history. It was assembled for the coronation. It was together with MCR nine, took they were identical. They had the same they're identical units with identical cameras, and they were directed from the vans into one of the side chapels at Westminster Abbey for the coronation. So all this equipment had been used the coronation apart from the zoom lens that was a later addition. But they were then after the carnation they were reassembled and MCL 10 was allocated to Birmingham. And that was the Birmingham OB unit. And of course it had its length, its links unit to go with it. And so all my experience on OBS with was with MCL 10. Anyway, that's in us in Dudley zoo in Birmingham on a very, very cold wet winter morning as I recall. We were issued with these marvellous Fen tiles suits which were wind and water and weatherproof they were absolutely fabulous. They were one of the great benefits of being with the OB unit. Whether right oh, that's me now this is me and gosta green you'll see is more of this data that's that's been taught to operate the sound mixer in Gospel gospel green.

Speaker 2  29:12  
So when you first joined when you went to carpenter Road, was that only carpenter road at that point the won't be the one.

Speaker 1  29:19  
We were in the year or so before. One of the derelict redundant mobile control rooms, mobile units in London I think I'm not sure whether it was that 767 or eight. It was one of those three but I can't I've never been able to discover which one was sent to Birmingham completely gutted and semi reassembled in the old middle and night orchestra studio, which was the main gathering Hall at carpenter road because carpenter road was the Royal blind Institute and had been out in mind Queen Victoria I think in about 1890. And the BBC acquired it, I think after the war for its regional headquarters for radio, I've got I've got that, right, something like that. And then the television unit was moved in just a year or so before I joined it. So I'll tell you a bit more about that when we look at the other set of slides. But just as all finished the sort of personal rubbish. My life with the BBC was short and marvellous, I have to say, I, I look back with huge pleasure. But in 1960, and I won't go into all the reasons I resigned in order to train for the Anglican priesthood, right. I left with great regret. It was one of those extremely mixed feeling situations, but there we are. That was a choice I made. And I went to train with a theological college near Newark, at a place called Kingdom Hall. And I was there for five years training for the priesthood. Kingdom Hall is an extraordinary place. This building here is the well, the original Hall was mediaeval. And then then then it was burnt down then the Palladian building was not that burnt down. And then eventually the family the manners Sutton family, got dialled Scott, to design them this extraordinary class a Gothic building, which bears a striking resemblance, you may realise to St. Pancras station. In fact, it was for some Pancras station, you tried out all sorts of things that you now, if you look at that tower, you'll recognise immediately that look, it's a clock tower on which some encrustation was based a few years later. Anyway, the banners Sutton went bankrupt, building this place and it was never finished and it was on it was derelict on the market for years. And the religious community who had started theological college and they were over in the East Anglia. They bought it with the large amount of land that was around it. And it became their main Theological College with nearly 100 students and, and then in the 1920s, they built this the famous Kellen chapel, which is with the dome here. And this and then later on in the just before the war, and after they built more student accommodation here. This was the grand entrance hall when it was when it was the the mansion of the man in Sutton family. And this, the coaches came in this was all glass. And this is we're talking about 1819 1900. And their coaches drove in through here and loaded in the palm court and drove out again through there. That Refectory exploit extraordinaire, extraordinary situation. Anyway, there was five years theological training. There's me supposedly doing some work. And this was the marvellous chapel that we

Speaker 2  33:31  
used for light, isn't it?

Speaker 1  33:35  
It's magnificent. So the 150 households, about 150 of the members of the community, and the students and the community have houses in Africa and Australia. And the Western is what this was the mother house, then that's me. I started the class of 25. And the eight of us survived to the end of the training. The dropout was quite high. It was quite quite demanding. didn't live wouldn't hold, of course. Only about less than a quarter of any intake of students ever passed all their exams. That was not

Speaker 2  34:14  
right. It's very selective.

Speaker 1  34:17  
I think in my class, I think there were four of us that actually got graded. See at the end, that there we are. So that that that's me. And that's a great friend of mine who lives only a few miles away from me now in retirement near Taunton. He was from Ghana went back to Accra. I think he became a bishop later on. Anyway, there we are, that that was that was us. I then, when I was ordained and in I was sent to east again, one went where Omar was sent one was sent one didn't have any choices. I went to a parish in East London and In my dig, so I was able to rebuild my amateur radio station that was that. I was I joined a very marvellous local group of amateur radio enthusiasts in the area. And we were asked to man the station, this was such an outside the old Daily Mirror building for the City of London festival, MGB to allow that so it was, of course record recollection of to ello, the very first broadcasting station with the BBC back in 1922. And we we set up this this demonstration amateur radio station, and the aerials we put on top of the Daily Mirror building, so they were about 150 200 foot above us, and it attracted huge interest from the general public. And these are some of the people that were operating. He was chairman of the radio Society of Great Britain, Sylvia Margolis, who was, who organised all this she. She was quite a famous broadcaster with BBC. She did a lot of radio broadcasting anyone on the radio side of the BBC, we know Sylvia Margolis, she was an amateur and her husband and her sons. He was from America. That's yours truly. Yeah. Remember who the others are. Anyway, that that's just just just what I was sort of vaguely interesting. All the fun. I then moved to the Diocese of St. Albans, Hertfordshire and Bedfordshire. And I was there for eight, nine years, where I met my dear wife, who at that time was working at Rothamsted the Agricultural Research Unit in in Hartfordshire. She's she's an ENT was an entomologist, graduated at Cambridge and Imperial College. And with the we married and I was immediately sent by the Bishop of St. Albans, Robert Runcie to a parish country perishing in temperature. Well, we had a very happy time and they had two children. Steven, Elizabeth and Steven, it was a GP and and palliative care specialist and Stephen went into went to Cambridge and got the first in computing science and he has rights all the software involved with medical scanning or and he's married to another medic, an oncologist consultant of the Royal box and they've got two boys and my daughter's got two girls so that's that's the family Oh, at least in this in the country parish I could put up another tower

Unknown Speaker  38:17  
that's quite similar to your first time Yes, is your first bit

Speaker 1  38:22  
more likely to actually definitely climb but well we can't have one of those now you'll see I'm in conservation area in in the Cathedral City in a list so I have to be very very discreet. And that's just a shot. That's me and so full fig in my last parish one of the things that the family and I have greatly enjoyed we got very involved with canals and I we had a series of ever increasing secondhand boats and eventually I commissioned the building of the steel worker this hole and then fitted today this was our boat we travelled all over the country. In our holidays I spent all my holidays together. Allocation and we go for three or four weeks in the summer holidays and we might up into Yorkshire and Lancashire and Vida all over the East Anglia and the boat so that that was that was our boat named No Didn't it was a concert notice very discreetly often. In honour of my wife you'll see Sarah diplomacy

Speaker 1  39:47  
Yes, we fitted I have the whole builds and then spent 11 years fitting it out and traditional style did all the woodwork and so on and my wife did all this marvellous painting in the traditional on Canal style, she inherited her mother's artistic talents, roses and castles and so on. And this was our marvellous engine which lived in its own engine room our pride and joy just so that that was that was our booting interests. And then when I retired, I got very involved in model engineering, as well as be able to review that but I ended up with being a founding member of a new model engineering society. And we eventually got permission to build a miniature railway in the bathroom I show grand the royal bath of my show grand in Somerset near Shepton mallet, and these some of our locomotives and this was the one I built. Here again, notice I've made it so, yeah, so we, we built this is about a third of a mile track and the character 1000s of passengers through the various events that the show grand icon, especially the bathroom, I show again, pathways show and on one occasion, I have the privilege of carrying him His Royal Highness who is very much interested in seeing steam locomotives, he takes very keen interest and so I was his driver. And the whole train was filled up with his entourage and security, who were not told us. They did all sorts of security visits beforehand and said under no circumstances will His Royal Highness be allowed to travel in the train? He arrived on site and the first thing he said, right, how do I get a ride? It completely security guys. I probably got on the train and we took him for a ride. We thought he might ask for it. So we were ready.

Speaker 2  42:02  
We're not going to say no. Are you gonna

Speaker 1  42:05  
say no, no. No, he was very gracious and thoroughly enjoyed himself. And because of giving the crowds a big wave as you went round. And that's the little electric tram I built for my family. That's my son, Steven. My grandson, Samuel, my other grandson, Robin. And these are some hangers on Oh, that's my granddaughter. That's Sophie. That's that was something that they could drive when they came to see me. And then I've been I've I've always taken quite a keen interest. I suppose it was travelling on steam trains when I was going to school. I'm involved with the Lynton and Barnstaple railway, which is down in Devon. And that's their new locomotive Lin that I've been quite involved with. And also been quite involved with the new mainline locomotive tornado. That's the one that has been on the BBC quite a few times. You remember. They did the race to Edinburgh on occasion with with what's his name? The

Speaker 2  43:24  
the trio of Jeremy Clarkson and

Speaker 1  43:27  
Jeremy Clarkson. Yes, he was on the footplate for that. But we've been part of the support group for that. And, and they have many I've had I've written on the footplate. Just to finish off with this is this is back in gosta green in the 1950s. This is I claim an early selfie. There's me with my newly acquired 35 mil camera, taking a picture of the mark three Marconi, which is taking a picture of me. So I reckon that's the first selfie. There's another selfie. This is this is where I'm sitting at the moment. This is my Amateur Radio Shack. And I'm now deeply into digital television and particularly via we have an amateur an amateur radio dedicated geostationary satellite link. So, this is the picture this is this is this is how things have changed since the 1950s. That is now the camera. This is the camera control unit. And this is a picture of me being taken by that camera, having travelled 40,000 kilometres up to the geostationary satellite and over Central Africa and back again. And that is a live picture of me via satellite. So I met and that's another selfie so there we are. That's That's again all home built. This is the this is the television controlling compare it when we go to Gaza green with its equivalents which required a crew of five people to run so one little box and that then feeds the power amplifier here, which then feeds the dish and the dish feeds zero sends the signal up to the satellite and then receives it back again. So there we are. So I think that's that's that so if we close that one then

Unknown Speaker  45:53  
ah okay

Unknown Speaker  46:04  
I need to go to so that was your your personal history. And then

Speaker 1  46:14  
now now I'm going to go and look at this one. Here well, gosta grid now this is carpenter road.

Unknown Speaker  46:30  
Okay. Can it go bigger? Is

Unknown Speaker  46:37  
Oh, you're not getting a full screen?

Speaker 2  46:39  
No, no, I'm just getting the thumbnails. Ah. Right.

Speaker 2  46:56  
You're getting it now. No, still discussing thumbnails. I wonder if show again. It worked so well on the previous ones, didn't I? Yes, yes.

Speaker 1  47:12  
Yep. happy with that. Yep. Right. So this is carpenter road, in the 1950s. And this was sort of BBC headquarters radio and television. And, of course, before television arrived, it was the headquarters of the middle night orchestra. So we, I'm afraid we pinched their studio, I'm not quite sure where they went to be after we took it over. I presumably they got it back when we moved to gosta. Green. I'm not sure about that. But that it was rigged out the scaffolding to help so that they could hang lighting. And everything was in jury rigged from that. So this, this was the equipment that this is from the American catalogue. This is the RCA TK 10. And the BBC acquired its I don't know how many sets of these they have. But these were the ones that were commonly used, particularly in the MCR six, seven, and eight. And it was one of those that was D rigged and used for the first studio in Birmingham. So each camera have a control unit. And this there was as a senior engineer who would look after the master monitor here. And each camera had its own control unit and control unit operator and its own power supplies and pulse shapers and pulse generators and so on. So it was quite complex. So when we go to the next shot, this is the can. Everything all rolled into one the the four this is how we did television in 1956 57 in Birmingham. This was this was it. And you can see a motley collection of all sorts of different and redundant monitors of different these were the camera controlling it. So each one there were three of them. Each one had a one of the engineers sitting in front of it with the senior engineer then down below behind. This is the production desk with a producer sound and the vision mixer and time a clock hung was string and hand well man that that was off the main main timepiece. So you can see how extraordinarily well how we got away with it. Every spent more time being maintained and repaired than, you know. But we did a remarkable number of programmes we did every week we did gathers but with Percy thrower, we did keep fit with it and follow. We did farming programmes. We did children's programmes we did. I remember doing a whole hour orcas filled with a full, full orchestral concert. We did all sorts of drama programmes, often as long as an hour. Can you imagine with no video recording, everything was done live. So if a mistake was made, that's what that's just what happened. You know, if something broke, it broke. It was amazing. And just behind. This is one of the engineers actually sitting just behind him, there's a door and behind that door was the studio where they produced the archers every night. So we have to keep very quiet very important to semblance and my Glock when the archers was going out, so the radio was still being done from the same building as the dome

Unknown Speaker  51:13  
looks quite cramped there.

Speaker 1  51:15  
Oh, it was oh, it was yes, yes, no air conditioning or anything like that. This was the camera and one of the cameras from from from the This again is the American TK 10 I think Marconi has a licence to copy them. But I think it was this was an American one. Anyway, it's what came with the direct. And this was our sound studio that we made this ourselves out of hardboard. And behind the hardboard we went out and acquired a large number of egg trays, you know, the the grey? Yeah, well, those those those are all stuck to the wall, and then cover that with this slotted hardboard to give a sort of decent acoustic. This was this was our regular Six O'Clock News studio. And on Saturdays, this is where we did all the local sports reporting.

Speaker 2  52:14  
So it's amazing that things went on air. I mean, it's so sort of Heath Robinson, isn't it?

Speaker 1  52:19  
It was all hand to mouth. It really was. That's your Yours truly, as one of our engineers just messing around. For the sake of the picture.

Unknown Speaker  52:32  
Cameras did you have three,

Speaker 1  52:34  
that's just three, we didn't have a spare there. When we went to Costa green, we had four we had three, three, working on one, always permanently on standby warmed up ready to go. So that that received the way things were to work with three cameras and a spare because in therapy that would get needed. So this is gosta green gel just after we moved in we had a special week when it was open to the public so that they could come and see how it was done. And you can see we've put the links van there with the links with the because of course in those days, the your signals were sent down the spine, the coaxial spine from Birmingham to London. For for national broadcasting, there was a spine that ran from I think from, I think from Edinburgh and Manchester Birmingham. It was there was a branch off to Bristol and then to I went to Lyon grove. But anyway wherever the main main switching centre was in London. So if you're doing a national broadcast from the studios, it went down the coax link. While we were at carpenter road, the signal had to be sent down an ordinary telephone pair of twisted, twisted pair that was, so we had to put a huge amount of power in at one end with it. So we built a massive amplifier to get enough signal to creep at the far end, in switching centre and Broad Street. But of course, when we went to Costa green, we had dedicated lines, but the links were used with OBS to get the signal from the outside broadcast to the nearest. Well, sometimes they did a whole series of hops to get good to get into the main network. So it was quite complex on outside broadcasts. Anyway, that's Scott's degree and that was of course had been a cinema. And it had been a boxing buzz. But the BBC acquired it gutted it and was completely refitted as the first proper studio for Midland spear babies BBC Midlands so inside we were brand new equipment which was of course for us was amazing having us saw the stuff that had been chucked out from London carpenter Road, suddenly we have brand new equipment. This is the Marconi mark three, four and a half inch and majority comm. Camera. It was absolutely brutal to move around. I mean, the two men left even without the lens as long. As I say compare that to what I'm using at the moment to talk to you and what you're using to talk to me.

Speaker 2  55:29  
Did you have any idea how much that camera would have cost?

Speaker 1  55:34  
You I did I knew that the one from I have a note somewhere? Oh, funny. You should ask me that. So I did actually. Somewhere? The one from America. Yeah. Once those cost in 1955 $15,000, which is equivalent to 114,000 pounds each camera and its controlling? Yeah. So I don't know what the Marconi ones were. But I guess something at least like that. And probably more, because they had Zeiss lenses. Harriet and goodness knows what those costs. I don't think cost was a problem in those days, to be honest.

Speaker 2  56:20  
But then you only had the three and the spare, didn't you? So they were

Unknown Speaker  56:26  
still talking probably getting half a million. Yeah.

Speaker 2  56:30  
You twisted that said these, you had different lenses, which were and then those would be rotated with those

Speaker 1  56:39  
different focal lengths to give you because we didn't get a zoom lens. While we were there we are issued with our first zoom lens for the outside broadcast unit, which I'll show you in a minute, I've got a picture of it. But here in the studio, you only had we didn't use Zoom lenses, we only had fixed lenses on the turret. And you'll have a box of different lenses and you choose for that was appropriate to the type of programme that you were doing. So you had a choice of lens that you could fit on the turret. But once they were fitted during the while the programme was going on, you didn't tend to change lenses on there, you simply rotated the turret to give you the angle of view that you need it. Right.

Speaker 2  57:26  
That you would nobody would cut to that camera when you were changing the lens.

Speaker 1  57:30  
No, no, no. No, the the the produce was would melt. It was all rehearsed. Yeah. But the producer would tell the camera man or the visual mixer but tell the camera man which camera and he was coming to and the cameraman will be prepared for the shot. But the producer would want it for that particular moment.

Unknown Speaker  57:54  
And you said camera man. So what was everybody on the engineering side? Male?

Speaker 1  58:01  
Yes, yes. That I could. Yes, we had. We had floor managers, leaders who are floor managers, Vision mixers. We had leaders, that sound mixers were all men, Vision mixers are all men. I mean, everybody on the engineering side? Yes, we Yes. For men? Yes, yes, we didn't have any leaders at that time. Right. This is right, this is looking from the production gallery into the visual control room through a soundproof window. So you see four camera control units, three would be operational and one would be stare. And the senior engineer was sitting in the middle here with the master monitor, and he would have the master waveform monitor. And he would instruct the the each of the camera operator camera control operators for the levels, black and white levels and all that that type of thing. So basically, the cameraman simply pointed the camera optically. And all the rest of the processing of the picture was done up here in the visual control.

Speaker 2  59:18  
This looks much more professional than the carpenter road setup. Well,

Speaker 1  59:22  
it's exactly the same thing. It's just just all tailor made for the job. Yes, yes. Whereas of course, what we've hadn't gotten to road was basically an OBD scanner that have been taken to pieces. Yes. And hung up on a Texian rack. I mean this, the producer didn't show you that on the previous pitch, but he was sitting on top of a packing case literally on the bus seat.

Speaker 2  59:46  
Right. So obviously investing heavily at this time, presumably in response to what was happening with ITV.

Speaker 1  59:55  
Oh, absolutely. Yes, yes, yes. So there was real competition going on. In fact, one of the problems the BBC were having to cope with was that if you pass the secret engineering exams that would not the BBC would threaten to lose a third of the of its output to ITV or overseas because it was the only place in the world that you could get ready trained Television Engineers, right. And we were all headhunted. As soon as we graduated, they, we were headhunted by the opposition, right? Yeah. Yeah, it was a real problem for the BBC, because they they were only source of trained Television Engineers in the world. And salaries were being offered that the BBC couldn't compete with. It was a it was a serious problem. Yes, several of my fellow trainees didn't come back to the BBC. One I think is now the senior engineer, somewhere in the Middle East, if I recall, wasn't to be retired. Certainly several went to the opposition in this country. This is a production gallery. This is looking back through the window you've just seen, this is where the producer, this is the vision mixer, see how small it was in those days, but only had three cameras or four cameras and tele cine. And that that's, that's the only vision that you have to mix anyway. And so, hence, the very small number of monitors compared to the hundreds that you see in production these days.

Speaker 2  1:01:40  
So outside sources at all, no,

Speaker 1  1:01:43  
not unless you have one coming in on links, which would be very unusual. You think occasionally we might have a hotlink in from an OB But that would be a rarity. See, over here as the lighting control, or the lighting engineer and through this window sign the same control, right, receives all sorts of purpose built for for duster, green. And this is these this is the sound mixer with all the line amplifiers and so on. Another one that that was Wally, our sound engineer with a paragraph for tape recordings and a turntable here. So the when you listened to them didn't didn't didn't have gardeners club, it was being played on an LP sitting on that, that their sound mixer. Have you seen that that's, that's me being trained. This was Teddy cine. Now in those in those days, of course, if you had, if you film something, the film had to be developed. It was that 16 mil film that was used to use. So if you have a news piece or a sports piece for insertion, it would be filmed on a 16 mil camera that the film would be brought back here would be processed and then put into this camera. And then the resulting picture was pointed at of a high quality television camera. So the television camera took the picture from the film. And that was known as tele cine. And that's how we got that's how we got recordings done. Observe very expensive, so didn't do it too often, producers limited on how much film they could use. And of course, nothing that you did was ever recorded. And that because you didn't have any means of recording it in those days. So no tape recorders and things like vision tape recorders in those days until the Ampex machines were imported towards the end of the 1950s. But they were only down in London. So if you wanted anything recorded, you have to book the lines to London for the production and then London would do the actual recording. So very little that we ever made was ever recorded. And so it doesn't exist in terms of archive. This is another this is another view this is the again that unit you just seen seen the film unit here. This is the other other parts of the 20th century and then this was you had Telly cine operators and then the feed from that will be sent through to the production gallery to be mixed with the output from the cameras from the studio. So this was next door to the vision control that you saw just through one door. There was a racks room with all where all the cabling came in and all the cross plugging was done. And here we are. Here's some some stuff from the studio itself gardeners club. Especially with this one observers with artificial grass around it. And his glasses studio. Yes. I don't think people ever tweet that there wasn't any glasses in his greenhouse, glass greenhouse. So they're the three cameras and boom operators, of course and so forth

Speaker 2  1:05:18  
is that he used to hang his coat up on a hook didn t.

Speaker 1  1:05:23  
When he walked in, yes, there was a hook, where he always hung his coat up. Yeah, that was part of the part of the

Speaker 2  1:05:31  
I remember somebody telling me that one day as a joke, somebody had taken the hook down. And

Speaker 1  1:05:39  
I don't remember that. But I wouldn't be at all surprised. It was all very informal. In those days, and every and the beauty of being an engineer, then it was you got to try doing everything. Although they were fully trained camera operators who did most of the actual, I've got a cup of coffee has just arrived. Yes, although, although you had proper training camera operators, from time to time, the engineers were allowed to actually do some camera work live. And again, there were sound engineers who would do the boom mics and so forth. But again, you were allowed to do that as well. So I've done boom, operating live, but on camera live. I've done Vinton crane operating it was one to steer and one to raise the camera up and down and so forth. So you got to do all jobs. It was it was a marvellous experience, which of course, it's not allowed these days, you know, you have your job and, and that's it. It's all very, very much demarcation. So there we are, those were the days. This was Eileen Fowler, and her keep flip, keep fit. Ladies, we did that every week. I think it was a Wednesday afternoon, it might have been a Tuesday afternoon. But that was one of our regular weekly features. We have a series of programmes we do every week farming today. Keep fit gardening gardeners world, and some sports programmes we did every week. And then of course, we did all sorts of other stuff in between and lots of drama. As keep fit again, with Eileen Taylor, there she is having a having a chat with the boom operator. Now, this was one of many very big dramas that we did, this was the case of private HAMP, which was a famous drama about desertion during the First World War. So hence, the this is obviously the second is meant to be in a agricultural building of some sort in, in France, or Belgium, with everybody in in uniform. And that was produced by Peter dews, I think, who was a very famous drama producer. Yes. And who

Speaker 2  1:08:13  
is it's not him, presumably on the left, is it?

Speaker 1  1:08:18  
I don't think so. So obviously, one of the production crew, obviously doing some sort of function, but hard to say, I can't, I can't remember, you'd have to find a picture of him on

Unknown Speaker  1:08:33  
a huge amount of design effort has gone into that.

Speaker 1  1:08:36  
Oh, absolutely. And what you got to remember is we would do an hour play like this live. So you had to move the cameras to the next setting. While you were. So there were cameras moving from one set to another, ready for the next shot. Because it was it was it was not like these days where you, you do a take recorded and then mix that and then then do a production, mix and edit afterwards. It was all done as a continuous live. I mean, we did some amazing and we did another military thing called the trial of Admiral being, which is about an admiral in the 19th century, who had done quite well I can't remember what you did wrong. But this we had the most amazing sets of a man of war with all the rigging and so forth. Extraordinary all in the studio, and again, with cameras moving around all these different sets for an hour. You know,

Unknown Speaker  1:09:40  
you'd have to release a camera to the

Speaker 1  1:09:43  
shot and absolutely, yeah, yeah, that's how it was done. And of course, the actors had to move and have to change change clothes. Yes, it literally while they were. While it was a it was a change of scenery. changes there. They lead to changing their costumes on the edge of the set, then yes, production it was a it was a remarkable what they managed to do. But a bit like theatre of course where of course you're it's a continuous production. This is Percy and this was a Christmas, Christmas pre Christmas Show. This person is doing potted plants. Right. And some sort of discussion going on here in the background which I think you see another shot. Yeah, there we are. So again, this this greenhouse, just just offset and marvellous decor, the 1950s

Speaker 2  1:10:45  
Yeah, this would have been taken up and put down after

Speaker 1  1:10:50  
each. Oh, yes, this was all been done just simply for that one. One programme. Yeah. There's another aerial shot. There's a staircase going nowhere. Look, there's this greenhouse look out there or that so the cameras would have moved around the back of there ready for if he wants to do something from the front and he's so he goes through the door and I do his greenhouse. Yeah, it has the marks mark three Marconi on its Bintan crane. And so

Speaker 2  1:11:21  
did you you took all these photographs just to because you

Speaker 1  1:11:26  
Well, I got a new 35 mil camera you see so yes, I was just just some out of interest for myself, just this sheer sheer chance to soak up all this. That's

Speaker 2  1:11:37  
fantastic because I haven't seen anything like this in terms of documenting what was there before it is

Speaker 1  1:11:45  
I think it probably is about all because you know, particularly with colour slides, you know the you're talking serious money for 3030 roll a 35 millimetre colour because of course you have to send it away to be processed and we'll come back as mounted slides and I still got those the that's the pictures you're looking at are my colour slides that haven't deteriorated because some of them depending on the make the over 60 years of course the colours have deteriorated. So I scan them in with a slide scanner and then and then process them with Photoshop that to try and restore the colour rendering. So that's what you're looking at now. Grateful that they survived you know that's again another bit blurry that one, but again, Percy again you see how the cameras are working together another one has Percy in the greenhouse with a obviously with a visitor. Obviously an expert on pot plants I imagine. But it so this is a good view of gosta green studio here because you're with the backcloth behind obviously what the cameras are seeing but these are the steps up to the production gallery. So the production gallery is up here looking through through through the window, this window here and that goes on up into the lighting gallery again tree which runs around the top of the studio. That's just that's just the camera crew messing about during the lunch break. Because this this is one of the senior camera month what we were doing there, but this is a good shot of the Bintan Vinton crane. We only had one of those in the studio. The other the other the other cameras were just floor mounted back to Gloucester green, it would not Yes, sorry. It was it would not would not Yes. And then into that now a few I thought you might like to see a few of MCR 10 On that side broadcast. I know I cannot for the life of me remember why we were here or where it is. And it'd be lovely if anyone if someone says oh I know where that is. That recognise that building. I'd be very grateful if you could let me know Vanessa you can it's a farmyard and that is what you think it is. And it was a filthy wet day and the poor riggers who put out all the all the cables were working. Everybody was working in Wellington boots. It was the most unbelievable quagmire of farmyard manure and water and here we are that this is this is this is MCR 10 And these are the here's the links that links vehicle get up into back to Sutton Coldfield. I think that's probably where that was pointing. So it's somewhere in the Midlands, and these are the support vehicles. But that's the conditions we worked under. Sometimes were extraordinary. Then another time you'd be at a test match on a summer Stay with all the equipment running full of vowels, of course, and it got incredibly hot. And there was there was an attempt to the air conditioning, but it was not much more than a draft.

Unknown Speaker  1:15:12  
Like 50s, would it? This

Speaker 1  1:15:14  
was in the late 50s. In the late 50s.

Unknown Speaker  1:15:18  
This lady at the back of the truck,

Speaker 1  1:15:21  
yes, she's probably one of the production crew. Yeah. Yeah, she's probably probably about probably vision mixer or the producers assistant. Yeah, because she's always had an assistant who'd be working with all the paperwork alongside Sharpless shaftless and so forth. At here's another view of it, yes. SMCR 10 articulated vehicle, which goes the later ones were all of a piece, but that in those days, MCL 10 and nine were articulated. And there's the attempt to the air conditioning tries to dry Yeah, soon see, see the, the poor riggers had to take all the cabling and then of course, there was masses of cabling all had to be taken back to carpenter road and, and had to be washed and disinfected. I mean, it was we were in a dreadful bubble mess. That's the links we'll go back to Sutton kill Oldfield. But those memorable occasions, we've seen that shot before the zoo. kennis wasn't home when we were helping televise the Wembley Cup final was another memorable occasion.

Speaker 2  1:16:39  
So this was what in 1966? No, there's

Speaker 1  1:16:43  
been 1958 or 59. Okay. Because I left the BBC in 1960. Right. So anything you'll see from me a BBC bias is pre pre 1960. In 1916, I left in the men did I leave September 1960. So it's all prior to that. So anyway, that's kind of forcing home that's one of our MCR 10 cameras up in the up in the commentary position? For I'd say either 58 or 59 Cup final? Which teams it was you'll have to look it up

Unknown Speaker  1:17:20  
so you can go all over the country obviously,

Speaker 1  1:17:23  
all over the country. Yes, this is on Oulton Broad. This will be just been given our new zoom lens. And our new rifle. This is a directional microphone known as a rifle mic. So it picks up sound in a very specific way. This was this was all very new. We got one of the we were very excited to be a shoe was one of those. And this particular case, I haven't gotten any pictures of it. But the one of the most important things we did was to interview Cockcroft, the inventor of the hovercraft, because it was all on the secret list at the time. And he demonstrated his model, the very first hovercraft on Oulton Broad with you demonstrated on television and mobile of it, which we we were there doing a series of children's programmes I think it was called children's roundabout or something like that. We went around different villages with all sorts of circus acts in and we and we went to Great Yarmouth and did end up pier shows in Great Yarmouth. That was a Saturday night production this is Birmingham, Racecourse. I don't think it exists any longer. Dunlop building. Okay. Which has long since I think that's been has that been

Unknown Speaker  1:18:45  
demolished? No, no, it's

Unknown Speaker  1:18:49  
still there. Is it? Right? Yes. I

Unknown Speaker  1:18:51  
think it's listed actually. So

Speaker 1  1:18:52  
yeah, okay. Right. Well, that'll give you the context. And this is at the far end of the race course. The the main scanner and production and main cameras roll up at the start and grandstand end and I was sent down this end to man, a separate unit we direct one of the cameras put it on top of the scaffold tower with a zoom lens and our own links fan to link back to the UHF link back to the vein production to get the horses when they came around the centre of the course which was a couple of miles away. This is for pitch from the top here. See we've got the rifle mic and there's the fan that I was operating. There's there's my Austin Seven look faithful. She is Aggie she was known as and one on the BBC Land Rovers the view of it all.

Speaker 2  1:20:07  
So the front vehicle is the actual OB track with it.

Speaker 1  1:20:14  
Well, it temporary, this is a temporary one. And this is yes. And link, this has links here. This is the latest vehicle. And I'm in this one. It's just a general purpose fan that that was used for moving equipment around in and we repurpose it for this occasion for the camera control unit for this camera. So the pictures will come from there into my van to the camera control unit. And then from there, it will be sent through the links to the main scanner, which was at the other end of the racecourse.

Speaker 2  1:20:48  
Right. So it was a remote feed into the Yeah,

Speaker 1  1:20:52  
that's right, that says remote feed. Yeah, so there I have the standard camera control unit. For the for that camera. Just just temporarily mounted on desean with other bits and bobs here, because you have to have your own pulse. Down here is the power supplies and pulse generators. Because you have to generate all your pulses independently and then synchronise them. So you didn't get a frame role. When you switch from one camera to the other, you would get a frame what was called a frame roll, you know, the black lines that ran up and down. So synchronisation was it was it was it was a great problem on movies, particularly if you're feeding into the network because you have to synchronise with the with the network, National Grid. And if you're running off generators, which of course we were then here we had no power supplies. We had a small portable generator running all this. You have to synchronise the 50 cycles of the regenerated so life got very complicated. Yes, lunchtime. That's John Jevons. That's one of the names I remember. He was a senior to me, another another engineer. He was a cameraman. He was the links engineer. He was one of our new recruits. And I can't remember who that was like, again, I can't remember John's this a long time ago to you just anyone else who sees this and say, Oh, that was me. If they're still alive and kicking. Yeah, my apologies for not remembering the names. There we are. But they was excellent. Yes.

Unknown Speaker  1:22:42  
It's quite a smart livery. It has very

Speaker 1  1:22:45  
smart Oh, yes. Oh, yes. One was very, very proud to work for the corporation in those days very proud. This was me on a camera. Coventry Airshow, right. That we did again, Saturday afternoon. Obviously, with vintage vehicles and things. Yes. So we did all manner of things test smashes Cup finals. Now and this was this will be a challenge to some of your people. When did the British Grand Prix where was this? And the answer is this is an entry round the Aintree Grand National racecourse there was a motor racing circuit was used for the British Grand Prix in the 1950s. It stopped at 1962 I think was the last time they did it. And so these just a few again, I was on a remote camera here. It's theirs. That's it thought that would be interesting to you, that there is that this is the actual racecourse, the famous Aintree Grand National racecourse here the dotted line and this is the the black line is the motor racing cars which ran partly on the outside and then came inside the horse race. And then the of course the the stands and so forth. We're here. So this is where we have the the main control scanner and so forth and the cat I think I was with a camera somewhere in this I think somewhere here. Yes, it was somewhere in the street

Speaker 1  1:24:44  
getting it was loss of lost me out there it is. That there we are there. They're the two main cameras up on top of the grandstand. They put the scaffold tower up. This is and this is the commentary positions. So see it's all well All jury rigged for the occasion. There's no cameras. And these are just a few of the shots. And that is sterling moss. Six I managed to find on the web, I managed to find an account of this particular race. And he came second, just and he's driving a BRM. For anybody who might be interested. Oh, see, here's our camera, man.

Speaker 2  1:25:33  
Yeah. So vulnerable, aren't they? Yes.

Speaker 1  1:25:37  
And here's your final shot. This is MCR 10s crew, a Great Yarmouth. And this is on the, at the seaside. And we were doing shows from the end of the pier show at Great Yarmouth in 19. I think 1959 or 1960.

Speaker 2  1:25:54  
So these would have been directed by Barry ago, presumably?

Speaker 1  1:26:00  
Yep. Me. Edgar was very good was very much a producer. For many of our programmes. Yes. That's the name that very much rings a bell. factor. I think he produced gardening club. Yeah, yeah. Yes. So it probably I wouldn't swear to it, but probably he started doing this. So be as well. Yeah. That was well, that was Wally our sound mixer. Yes. And that's our links, man. He was a cat. He was a camera man. He was senior engineer. In another camera, man. Yeah, but I'm pretty sure the names now escaped me. Sadly.

Speaker 2  1:26:48  
They're all wearing shirts and few ties and jackets as well. So quite. Camera operated with

Speaker 1  1:26:56  
the Oh, yes. Certainly. Yes. Yes. Well, depending on the occasion, but yeah. Oh, yes. I mean, even in the OB unit, you know, surfing it. You'd be wearing a tie. Yes. Yeah. Tie and jacket.

Speaker 2  1:27:11  
It's like you've maybe been playing football or something.

Speaker 1  1:27:16  
It might well have been kicking around on the beach. Christ. Yes. Yes. Put where it was fairly informal. But we were at the seaside after all. God let your hair down sometime. We are I think I think I think that's the end of end of the end of the show. Vanessa? All

Speaker 2  1:27:36  
right. Well, that's all fascinating. Thank you ever so much for that. So, so you had this this really interesting career split between, you know, being in the studios being on outside broadcasts, and then being back at base doing the maintenance and things? Absolutely. And that carried on throughout your period goes to green did it

Speaker 1  1:27:59  
did indeed Yes. Yes. It did. Yes. Yes, it was still going strong. But I think things began I mean, I kept in touch with with with one or two of the my fellow engineers there. I was I was godfather to John Jevons, firstborn. And we kept in touch and exchange Christmas cards for quite a few years. And I got the impression that things began to change quite quickly. And I think when they went to Pebble mill, I think the informality had gone and the the you did the job for which you were appointed and paid and you didn't do anything else. Right. In fact, it was extremely in politic to even pick up a cable because that was the job of the riggers. Whereas we would help the rigours of Regulus will help us sweet help the cameraman they'd help our suite help us. It was it was all very very demarcation. Let's put it that way. demarcation didn't exist in those days. And do you think

Speaker 2  1:29:08  
that's because it was such a new service? And it was finally there? No.

Speaker 1  1:29:15  
That there were no rules. There was a great deal of informality. And a lot of stuff you were doing because the first time you know, you were really seeing if you could manage it at times, you know, it was it was it was pioneering stuff. Yeah.

Speaker 2  1:29:32  
Did you feel like you were you were pioneers? It was

Speaker 1  1:29:36  
exciting. Yes, yes. Yeah, I mean, going to somewhere like Aintree, you know, to set up a rig to, to film Grand Prix racing. You know, that that was an it again, you go to places from different life. We go to Worcester for the first one. Then there was a test match series on with Australia. The first first cricket match played between the teams was always Mr. By tradition wasn't a test match, it was just a, a match between the two teams to get to know each other with when we have tried to remember the most famous cricket commentator, Brian and I can't remember. But I mean, when we get to know all these guys, you know, with their their cakes that they would sign up and eat and so forth, or, you know, in the commentary box, and yeah, yeah, so, yeah.

Speaker 2  1:30:36  
So did you could you have any say about which OBS or studios you worked on? Or whether you just rotated? No, no,

Speaker 1  1:30:45  
no, that you were directed by the senior engineer where you'll have been needed, you know, and you might be on base maintenance, and they suddenly had a need for your data caster green in the studio. Okay, so that's where you went, you know, I mean, I spent, I spent quite a lot of time during my caster green times, building a dubbing suite under the old stage. So that, that the, the, the, where we have the 16 mil Film Unit doing news and sports, once they've had the film, processed, they can take it down there to dump the sand onto it. So the sound dubbing suite for the Film Unit, which we could actually do on on the site, and therefore at a very short notice. But that all required all the equipment putting in and all the wiring done, and so forth, and so on. So that's one of the other engineers and I did that much of it, actually, I think, in the evenings in our spare time that that was part of the deal. Even doing

Speaker 2  1:31:56  
such generalists, because you've been trained in everything. Yeah, you were incredibly useful, because you could do all these different things. It's not,

Speaker 1  1:32:05  
not applied to most of us there in. I mean, there were people who were trained as camera operators, and that was a specialist. And I mean, and the optics and all that sort of thing, and they would discuss what lenses were going to be used and so on. That was very much their department. But they weren't selfish about it. They didn't say no, you can't do can't point my camera. But during production, during the actual live production, of course, they would be on the canvas, not to us, except for things like keep fit and garden as well, where, because we did it every week. And the and the setup was almost identical from one week to the next, you know, we would be allowed perhaps, to to operate one of the set, perhaps cameras, three, which would do solo shots, but the main camera work would always be done by the train cameraman. But the engineers, you know, we were allowed that sort of informality, which was nice. And you know, if you weren't doing anything, particularly you could send around the production gallery, but behind the producer, and watch the lighting engineer and learn about how he was doing all the lighting side of things, because that, of course, was another complete discipline on its own. And most lighting engineers were x Television Engineers. So they they knew it from the bottom up, as it were. I mean, certainly our senior engineer went on to be the senior lighting engineer, I remember him being applying for the job and getting it right, because of course, you'd then be up against competition from London and the other regions if because all jobs were always nationally advertised. There was there was a board in carpenter road with all the jobs throughout the throughout the BBC that advertise. So you were free to apply, you know, put in your your letter of application. And

Speaker 2  1:33:59  
what was the relationship between BBC Midland and say London and the other regions.

Speaker 1  1:34:08  
I suppose it would be fair to say that the region's were regarded as small fish by London. But on the other hand, they did rely on us for quite a lot of things. And we will be called in to do big, big things like like Cup final, where they needed more than one over unit. And if London didn't have enough resources, they were called in the regions. And again, we would go and help out the other regions, like the entry entry would normally be done by Manchester, but Manchester wouldn't have enough resources to do such a big event. So we would then be sent up to help them out. And likewise, they would come down and help us out if we needed it. And so there was a lot of interchange. But yes, I mean, White City was just coming on stream. I mean, now it turned into flat Sunday, but White City was the Apple in the BBC sigh because at that time in London Lime Grove was the main centre for studios and theatre production, but done at shepherds, Bush, and so on. And again, it was scattered all over the place. So White City was a great coming together in the purpose built marvellous. And it was a marvellous building. I mean, that part of our when I first joined the BBC, part of our initiation, shall we say, was being taken to light city to see this cutting edge. Wonderful purpose built, incredibly expensive. And this course was all being equipped with the Marconi mark three cameras, I think there were also EMI and pi as well. So I think the BBC sort of spread its customer around various various British manufacturing companies at that time. But I think it all got more standardised when colour came in, but colour wasn't even a twinkle in their eye at that point.

Speaker 2  1:36:10  
So had you got one sort of career planned and then decided on a change of direction or? Yeah,

Speaker 1  1:36:18  
so I mean, I've been Yes. Yeah. Basically. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2  1:36:22  
So if you carried on at the BBC, what would you have gone on to do?

Speaker 1  1:36:27  
I have no idea. I hope I might have become a senior engineer. I mean, one of this is really quite funny, and I hope you won't mind me telling you this, telling you this. But when I was at the BBC, one of our senior engineers was Duncan McEwan, who went on to be chief engineer for Northern Ireland, BBC an island. He then went back to London, but he eventually ended up being Chief Engineer for the whole of the BBC. He lived in Hemel Hempstead. And at that time that we're now talking about the 19 1990s Alright, so many years, I've been 30 years ordained priests. By that time, I was Rector of Berkhamsted and Duncan unbeknown to me, Duncan and his wife and daughters move to Berkhamsted. And he joined my congregation. And suddenly I found I was looking down from the pulpit on my old BBC boss. Yeah. So, you know, that was an extraordinary coincidence. And we became, he'd retired by that time. But we became very good friends. He was a, he and his wife. She was production. She was in BBC production. Kristen, Kristen again, some people will remember her. She Well, once, once met, never forgotten this Christian, wonderful character. But we became very good friends. And they were members of my parish, which was really rather stunning. We often laughed about the fact that I then I'd arrived as one of his probationary trainee engineers in the Midlands, some 3035, nearly 40 years before.

Unknown Speaker  1:38:37  
Serendipity there, isn't there. Yes,

Speaker 1  1:38:39  
yes. Just one of those very strange coincidence, but he lives now in Scotland, is it Kristen died, and he lives near one of his daughters up in Scotland.

Speaker 2  1:38:50  
So Well, you never tempted to go into the radio site, you because that that passion for radio was obviously what, what from with you from a very early age, and it's obviously still with you? Well,

Speaker 1  1:39:01  
I think, you know, television was was the thing to aspire to. I mean, that was the cutting edge. I mean, media was radio. I mean, maybe it'll be hasn't changed. Okay, I think so. But, but broadcasts radio is still broadcast radio was television in those days, everything was was was was to go for?

Unknown Speaker  1:39:22  
Everything's new. Yeah.

Speaker 1  1:39:23  
I mean, think how it's changed over the years, you know? Yes. So, so no, I wouldn't denigrate from moment radio. But on the other hand, from the engineering point of view, the interest was in television and and continues to be with miniaturisation and digitised and digital, but I'd like to serve a vision that I can now do from sitting here, upstairs in an old Victorian terrace that I can talk send pictures to someone in South Africa by a geostationary satellite. How extraordinary is that? Yes,

Speaker 2  1:39:57  
yeah. So you you to active for the BBC as a really exciting time, weren't you?

Speaker 1  1:40:04  
Oh, yes. Oh, absolutely, yes. And I think the Yes. I think the fact that there was that wonderful mixture of discipline, I'd like if there was a job to be done, you did it, and you kept on doing it until it was done. And you didn't say, oh, it's not going off time, or I'm going to be on overtime. Now you just, you know, you were proud to get the job done that you'd been asked to do. And you did whatever it takes to the that was it, there was a constant challenge because things were so unreliable. You know, things broke constantly. And we were the number of hours we used to get through hundreds and hundreds of hours, because they overheated, everything overheated, particularly in the scanner. Because there's no proper air conditioning. I mean, the amount of heat that was being generated by all this equipment is astounding. You know, at least in the studios, you had air conditioning. But no, I mean, I have vivid memories of, of literally dripping with sweat in in the, in the scanner. I remember particularly at Nottingham, at the test match at Nottingham, where we have where we I forget which year it would be but it was unbelievably hot. And of course you can't open the doors because you couldn't see the monitors because it'd be too light, too much light coming in. So you have to keep it dark, just be able to watch the monitors. And they're within adequate air conditioning. I mean, I guess the temperature is well over 100.

Speaker 2  1:41:49  
It's all really fascinating. So thank you very much for sharing that with me. Is there anything we haven't covered that you wanted to talk about?

Speaker 1  1:41:58  
I'll probably think of things afterwards. But no, I hope that gives you I hope the pictures are of interest. And, you know, we've filled the gap. Because it was an incredibly important stepping stone I think for BBC in. One thing I didn't mention we we when we were at carpenter road. In those early days, of course, we had a little makeshift studio for the news broadcasts and sports commentary and things like that. When we moved to gosta green. We have a separate new studio at the end Broad Street at switchings there was the GPO switching centre in the basement, where all the signals came in and out. And that was on the main spine between Scotland and London that I mentioned earlier on. In one of the spare rooms above that we built a new news studio and with an entirely new camera type of camera small camera called a vidicon which was about the size of a couple of shoe boxes. And that was the first transistorised equipment because all the equipment that went in goes to green that was still valves you'll see transistors that only just been invented. And the video carton camera was the very first miniaturised camera that the BBC had. And we had one of those I think that the pair of them actually in the new studio so we did all the news and continuity and sports reporting that was done from Broad Street and the back of that do you look down onto gas Street Basin?

Speaker 2  1:43:39  
Yeah, so and you'd get sent to Broad Street as well as

Speaker 1  1:43:44  
yes, we Yes, we do duty the aerosol. And then of course in later years when we had our narrow boat, I used to frequently boat through gas or through gastric basin on our boat and look up and think that's where I used to work. Because all the fun again another those serendipitous things. Yes, yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2  1:44:02  
It's all really fascinating. So thank you very much for for sharing.

Speaker 1  1:44:06  
It's been great fun meeting Vanessa and I'm just very pleased actually that I haven't kept all this stuff. It's, it's, it's not going to end up in the skip everything else due in a few years time.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai